ESPN, World Cup, The US

[Bryan Payne]

I've been doing a little research.  For several years now ESPN has renewed its efforts to cram "football" down the American audience's throat... despite the fact that there's just not a whole lot of interest over all; never has been.  This year it's reached something of a fever pitch with 24/7 coverage.  They're desperate to cover it in more detail because it is such a major event but...  rightly or wrongly it's seen in the US as a sport for kids and girls.. and that's mostly a marketing problem and just that we like it more.

The England/USA match... arguably the most anticipated one in the US maybe ever..  pulled a 2.1 rating.

Game Seven of the NBA Finals:  18.2 (game six did a 12.3)
NBA Countdown (pregame): 3.9 (more people are watching Charles Barkley mispronounce words)
Finals of the Masters: (golf for god's sake):  12.0
Men's Olympic Hockey:  17.6
Last Nascar race on TNT: 2.9  (because somehow we find driving in a circle more entertaining)
Stanley Cup Finals: 3.36 (being covered on a network half the country doesn't even have!)
US Open (golf again): 4.9

More perspective:
ABC drew a 2.2 final rating and 3.4 million viewers for tape-delayed coverage the World Cup Kickoff Concert, the night's lowest rated, least-viewed original program on broadcast.


Be great if there was more interest.. but it's just not there.  ESPN stop pretending there is.  Coverage is fine, to be encouraged, but it's starting to get like the round the clock coverage of the Gulf Oil spill on CNN.

[Cory]

Americans are idiots, and don't have pateince to enjoy the game. I admit it can be boring if you get 2 poor teams, but I mean....I dont know why they try to target US. It's slightly better up here in Canada, as it goes Hockey, then everything else, but people in north america don't understand the game.

[Bryan Payne]

Well, it's kind of an easy out to say it's "because they don't understand" but at the end of the day that's because they don't "want" to understand. 

You could say the same thing about Iranian's and Hockey "they don't understand it" they don't want to and probably never will.

[Jennifer]

They should try marketing rugger.

[Adam Wrong]

Americans only tend to partake in team sports that few othercountries participate in

[Rob]

Yeah MDK hit the nail on the head. America only are interested in stuff they're the best int he world at. Fortunately for them, there are 3 huge sports that they can dominate, yet when it comes to sports the rest of the world play they are fairly uninterested. They don't like losing, so I suppose if they pretend it doesn't exist and they're not losing, then everything's A-OK.

[Bryan Payne]

Wow.  That's a viewpoint I'm used to encountering, but it's fairly far from the truth if you look objectively at the history of sports in the US in general and how those big three came to dominate in the US.

Just because we've never warmed up to YOUR sport, is no reason to denigrate the sports we do like.  With three big sports already it would be difficult for any sports to break into a market already that saturated, as the US market was by the time that "football" went global.   The way TV viewing works here versus there also has a big part to play in it.  Mostly in Europe you watch the show in it's entirety and then there are like ten minutes of commercials where as here in the states it's all driven by commercial revenue to begin with so the commercials are intermixed in with the programs in bits.   The sports that are popular are meshed in that system, so that's where the advertising and marketing has always been... and those sports have adapted to that and become advertiser friendly for the most part.  They don't even do time outs when someone fakes an injury in soccer.

Most Americans who play soccer when they are younger develop an appreciation for it, but that's a rather small cross section of the middle class (generally white or Hispanic).  

The big three sports in the states (assuming you mean American Football, Baseball, and Basketball) became popular in the states in the 1800's for the first two and the other was born out of Afootball so it already had a built in market.  You have to consider what was going on at that time... Americans had just gained independence a short time ago.... the War of 1812, and then our Civil War.  Not only did those events lead to a rejection of most things seen as "narrowly European" but also became at times the only thing people from North and South had in common... a very narrow link that held polite society together.  No sport is going to have much success breaking into that kind of cultural relationship with given sports no matter how "popular" it is elsewhere.  So yeah, you really need to take a broader look at Sports history before you really make a blanket statement like that.

[Drama Queen]

Wow.  That's a viewpoint I'm used to encountering, but it's fairly far from the truth if you look objectively at the history of sports in the US in general and how those big three came to dominate in the US.

Just because we've never warmed up to YOUR sport, is no reason to denigrate the sports we do like.  With three big sports already it would be difficult for any sports to break into a market already that saturated, as the US market was by the time that "football" went global.   The way TV viewing works here versus there also has a big part to play in it.  Mostly in Europe you watch the show in it's entirety and then there are like ten minutes of commercials where as here in the states it's all driven by commercial revenue to begin with so the commercials are intermixed in with the programs in bits.   The sports that are popular are meshed in that system, so that's where the advertising and marketing has always been... and those sports have adapted to that and become advertiser friendly for the most part.  They don't even do time outs when someone fakes an injury in soccer.

Most Americans who play soccer when they are younger develop an appreciation for it, but that's a rather small cross section of the middle class (generally white or Hispanic).  

The big three sports in the states (assuming you mean American Football, Baseball, and Basketball) became popular in the states in the 1800's for the first two and the other was born out of Afootball so it already had a built in market.  You have to consider what was going on at that time... Americans had just gained independence a short time ago.... the War of 1812, and then our Civil War.  Not only did those events lead to a rejection of most things seen as "narrowly European" but also became at times the only thing people from North and South had in common... a very narrow link that held polite society together.  No sport is going to have much success breaking into that kind of cultural relationship with given sports no matter how "popular" it is elsewhere.  So yeah, you really need to take a broader look at Sports history before you really make a blanket statement like that.

With regards to your last point, it does not make it impossible for soccer to break through, but does make it difficult. Soccer was a taboo in Ireland up until the mid 80's when we finally qualified for something. Before then it was seen an an English game and one's nationalistic pride was questioned if one admitted to liking it. Then we all jumped on the Euro 88 bandwagon and loved it. Beating the old enemy England in our first game in any finals helpled a lot. The GAA still talk soccer down because they see it as a threat to our national sports of Gaelic football and hurling. but like the church the GAA does not have the same social power as it once had and people are doing their own thing, most people into sports play/wathc GAA sports AND soccer.

As far as ratings go you have to remember that the World Cup over here is on when we are working. I can only watch weekend games. I don't think the same applies to NBA finals and the other things you mentioned. It is defniately more popular than it was four years ago even if the ratings don't show that. People are talking about it, people are interested... just not at the same level they are in other countires (read my post in the main World Cup thread).

[Bryan Payne]

Already did; i find it a little shocking that anyone would get the day off for a sport event in general.  Take it off sure if that's what you want to use  your vacation days for but declaring a holiday for it?  We don't even do that for the Super Bowl and before you say anything the impact nationally of that event is mind boggling if you stop to think about it.   American Football is an all consuming obsession so the name factor doesn't help either.  It's a disconnect that makes it difficult for market penetration.

I'm not entirely convinced that the interest is greater than it was four years ago at least not measurably, I just think ESPN and a few other outlets have decided to make a major push now to promote it to try to increase interest .  Which is fair enough if a bit disingenuous.  American's have always paid just enough attention to see the score, at least sports fans in general. 

I'm not saying soccer will never be big in the US.  But it's not yet; and no one should expect it to be overnight because other people like it.  We still like baseball, for those who like to think only if we're the 'best' at something will we watch it, and we haven't been the best at that in fifteen years or more (granted I've always detested baseball, I'd rather watch paint dry on tv)  but the ratings are still solid for that as well.  Additionally Basketball has become an international sport with leagues in Europe, a big and growing market for it in China.. and baseball is massive in Latin/South America and parts of Asia (namely Japan and the Koreas).  So neither of which is really exclusively "american" any more. 

Additionally it being on in the time slots it is... doesn't matter as much as it used to.  The Nielson ratings for example include DVR records in their ratings just for an example.  It's a fair enough point on the time slot issue and is another of the reasons why it's never really caught on.  In this day and age you can't successfully market taped games because the scores are known world wide instantly.  Makes it tough to market it for the niche market that exists here now or to expand it compellingly.

However, until the NBA finals were over... putting the World Cup stuff into Prime Time would have even worse from a ratings standpoint... especially as that series went on, as a big part of the idea of expanding is to appeal to US watchers of other sports and get them to view.  Even casual interest is a start.  There is also an inherent stubbornness in Americans that is partly,  I think, shared by Canadians, Australians, and Brits of all stripes..  you try to force us to like something and we're going to tell you to kiss our ass on general principal.

[Adam Wrong]

I disagree Bryan. You can talk historical and if you do you will note the spike in 1950 when the US beat England. Fact is, very few countries play YOUR sports outside of the US. Eastern Europe tending to be the only ones.

You are saying that because we have commercials around the sport rather than vice versa that football is not as popular?

[Duckman]

I think the millions of Latino and Asian people in the US, as well as a lot of the European folks in the US would disagree with you Bryan as to the popularity of football.  They just don't support the US national team as far as I can tell.

Peace

Duckman

[Drama Queen]

I have to admit that since I finally found a soccer league to play in at the beginning of this year, my Spanish has improved drastically 

[Bryan Payne]

I think the millions of Latino and Asian people in the US, as well as a lot of the European folks in the US would disagree with you Bryan as to the popularity of football.  They just don't support the US national team as far as I can tell.

Peace

Duckman

Those people are present in all rankings.  I reported the ratings from the US game as they were the World Cup games that got the highest rating in the US.  So enjoy it they might, watch it they don't.

Adam: I'm saying how the sport is produced and marketed does have an effect on it's ability to penetrate the US market yes.  Not a sole factor.   As for the 1950's comment, that was a time that the country was a far different place than it is today immediately post WWII.  Also a time before television and "mass market" became a factor too, they read about the world cup in the paper listened to a report of it on the radio and then talked about it over supper.  Not really a situation that exists anymore.  Additionally from what you're saying immediately after that we should have had a soccer Renaissance in this country because we were "good" at it or something.  We didn't, the 50's-60's is when American Football replaced baseball as America's "past time."

Additionally American's don't even represent the majority of the people who watch/play baseball anymore, as previously indicated Latin/South America by far exceeds us in their enjoyment of the sport, and yes, routinely kick our asses in the World Baseball Classic..  hasn't hurt baseball in the states a bit.

[Ian "Wolfie" Trumps]

As a person who has spent a total of 5 years living in the States...Americans only do give a shit about ANYTHING they are good at. It has fuck all to do with marketing and sponsorship. Its the American way...nobody likes a loser in the USA.

[Cory]

^^ QFT.

Think about it. Last time peole gave a shit about soccer was when they beat Spain in that meaningless tourney last year. Then when they got beat by brazil, it fell to the wayside.