NBA Thread

[The TeeJ of Philly]

They're missing perimeter defense and consistent play. People talk about how Westbrook and Stephenson are detriments to their own teams, but Harden is even more because he plays no defense and if he's not scoring, Houston isn't winning.

Houston, great regular season team, poor playoff team the way they are built right now. Teams play defense and the game goes into the half court.

[thecolonel]

They're missing perimeter defense and consistent play. People talk about how Westbrook and Stephenson are detriments to their own teams, but Harden is even more because he plays no defense and if he's not scoring, Houston isn't winning.

Houston, great regular season team, poor playoff team the way they are built right now. Teams play defense and the game goes into the half court.

Completely agree with you on the lack of defense by Houston as a whole. Dwight, Asik, and Beverley are all I saw playing any great D the whole series (honor mention to Parsons for at least trying at times). Besides Patrick Beverley, Houston lacks a defensive perimeter player from what I saw. Also agree with you that Portland exposed Harden's lack of defense in games. I don't think I ever noticed it when he played with OKC as much as I did this series with Wesley Matthews posting him up like it is nothing. I find it interesting that you mentioned Stephenson and Westbrook. With the Atlanta series exposing Luis Scola for his lack of defensive capabilities and terrible defensive spacing of the whole team, do you think it also exposed Stephenson's lack of defensive IQ? Atlanta keeping the screen & pops (and off-ball screens) and switching who is coming off of them really seems to confuse Stephenson especially with his man (usually Korver, Teague, or Williams).

[GM Franchise]

Found this. It's the NBA Stats Player Tracker of Defensive Impact for the Playoffs. Can also be filtered to show the Regular Season as well.

http://stats.nba.com/playerTrackingDefense.html?pageNo=1&rowsPerPage=25

[thecolonel]

Interesting. Stats seemed skewed as Perry Jones, Nando De Colo, and others similar top the FG% at the Rim (0%). Also find the stat interesting to calculate (as they never gave their measure to doing so). Nonetheless, cool find. I find Harden's 21.4% with .5 FGM and 2.3 FGA stat more interesting. Tells me the stats calculate probably only the in the paint defense which skews specifically to smaller (better looking) defensive percentages for guards as most don't follow their man and/or contest in the paint.

Still very cool find Franchise. I didn't know it existed outside of Advanced Stats in Basketball Reference, or the calculated defense that was on Synergy Scouting.

[¿PapaPancho?]

Lillard is not a top 5 PG ... that kool aid be strong.

[GM Franchise]

If he's not he's close. He's definitely in the mix though but he's more of a scoring PG which I think lowers his ranking slightly as it relates to that. Here are the point guard stars from the season.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/double-doubles/sort/doubleDouble/seasontype/2/position/point-guards

[Justin]

Lillard is not a top 5 PG ... that kool aid be strong.

Name me 5 that are better.

[Jon]

Name me 5 that are better.

Chris Paul, Derek Rose, John Wall, Stephen Curry, Kyrie Irving

[Gates]

Rose has talent, however until he can stay healthy, I personally wouldn't list him in my top 5...

[Justin]

Chris Paul, Derek Rose, John Wall, Stephen Curry, Kyrie Irving

Chris Paul - I agree with.

Derek Rose - A healthy Rose is the best point guard in the NBA, so I agree.  I just hope he can comeback at his prior level of play.

Stephen Curry - I'm a huge Curry fan, but I don't let that cloud my judgment.  Sure, Curry is a premier scorer, but he averages almost 4 turnovers a game and at times turns the ball over at alarming rates. 

John Wall - I think Wall is too inconsistent.  The thing about Wall is he has the chance to be GREAT.  He has all the tools and talent to be a superstar, but he is just too inconsistent.  He disappears for games at a time and tends to catch the turnover bug as well.

Kyrie Irving - I believe Irving and Lillard are on the same level.


Not to mention Lillard has proven to be more durable than everyone on the list.  Granted he's only been in the league two years, but he's played all  games in both seasons.

And someone is poised to ask, so my top 5 PGs (healthy) are:

Derek Rose
Chris Paul
Rajon Rondo
Tony Parker
Damien Lillard

[Jon]

Rose has talent, however until he can stay healthy, I personally wouldn't list him in my top 5...

He was a former NBA MVP. Hurt or not, still a Top 5 PG. He'll be back next season and I hope he can stay healthy, because he is incredible to watch.

And I would also list Westbrook and Lowry and Rondo (who also needs to stay healthy) in front of Lillard as well.

EDIT: Meh, Parker is a bit older now to be in the Top 5. He does his job well, but is not the player he used to be. Where Lillard lacks is true passing and defense. Curry might turnover the ball 1-2 times more, but he shoots better, passes better, and defends better. John Wall easily better than Lillard... Wall has the best court vision outside of Chris Paul in the NBA. And Kyrie Irving is not on the same as Lillard... once again... I think Kyrie is a better shooter, passer, defender.

I would put Lillard on the same level as Isiah Thomas of Sacramento. Both good scorers, marginal passers, who lack good transition defense.

But I think Lillard has a ton of potential and if he keeps getting better at the things he doesn't do very well, he could turn into a Top 5 PG in a few years time.

[Justin]

Did you really just put Lillard on the same level as Isiah Thomas??

I agree with you on Wall about the court vision, but like I said, he is too inconsistent and aggravates me because Wall could seriously be a top 3 player in the league.

[Jon]

Did you really just put Lillard on the same level as Isiah Thomas??

I agree with you on Wall about the court vision, but like I said, he is too inconsistent and aggravates me because Wall could seriously be a top 3 player in the league.

Hey, you tried putting him on Kyrie Irving's level. So I had to pick the player he closer resembles. Although I like Lillard far better than Thomas. But their playing styles are pretty comparable.   

And how can you justify putting Rondo in your Top 5 with 3.3 turnover/pg but not Curry because he has 3.8 turnover/pg?

It's easily Paul then Curry right now in the NBA with Rose sitting injured.       

[Justin]

If you want to use nothing but stats to compare the players then yes, Lillard and Irving are on the same level.  They both averaged 20 points and 6 assists.

A healthy Rondo is great.  Sure, he can't shoot, but his court vision is is top 3, he is not only the best defensive point guard, but one of the best defenders in the league.  He is the best overall passer and can get to the basket at will.  Rondo is the ultimate game and team manager, which is what you need and want out of a point guard.

[Justin]

Not to mention, Rondo is a great rebounder as well.