So the guy has gone from challenger for the top spot in Denver to 3rd choice QB and potential trade rumours...ohhhhh how the mighty seemingly have fallen. Discuss!
Im a HUGE Tebow fan, hes the greatest college football player of all time, hes probably one of the top athletes for his charities and really wanting to help people, and he has no ego. He knows that he needs to work, but I think with his work ethic, his natural leadership, hes a winner, and lets be honest, in his 3 starts, 5 TDS, 2 Rushing TDs (both over 25 yards) and only 3 picks.......those are hardly numbers to outright bench the guy or call him a bust.
But the crazy thing is, there's nothing coming out of training camp about his poor performance, its all been internet bloggers and when Brady Quinn was named #2, there was a big thing on the NFL network about this "shocking development" (or well as much as there can be about the Denver QB situation), which means it took most analysts by surprise.
I think John Fox has too much to lose if Tebow doesn't pan out, so hes going with the safe side in Kyle Orton, who only looked good for 6 games last year then shit the bed. Tebow has the most upside, and John Fox doesn't know shit about QB's. Jake Delhomme the last 3 years in Carolina was consistently one of the worst QB's in the league and Fox was the worst coach on the worst team last year. Broncos fucked up firing Josh McDaniels.
Should Tebow be a starter this year? If he proves it yes, but he wont get a chance getting TWO snaps in a pre-season game. Tebow should leave and go to Miami or Buffalo (I hope Buffalo so when the move to Toronto I'll have my favourite player)
I saw this thread and I just had to reply, since this was from August, the progress on Little Timmy is just great. I'm not the biggest fan of his but to see him come out on top from all of the controversy that is on him to be the starter, and win four out of five games to give his team a boost and a chance to be atop the AFC West ranking being that they are now one game behind the RAAAIIIDDEERRSS!
Most of the convo is a split between his throwing mechanics and his faith. Let the man do his thing, what's wrong with praying before, during and after a game? That's what he do, let him do it.
His mechanics do need major work but that will come. Right now he's a huge surprise to Denver. Ever since I saw that Thursday Night game against the Jets and the way he just 'dissasembled' the Jets D' on a 95 yard drive, him getting 92 of it was special. It's like when the 4th Quarter strike, Tebow goes into "Cool" mode and just somehow find a way to win! I've watched him when the games aired on CBS when he was still with Florida. He did extremely well.
Spread offense isn't the way in NFL but Tebow's making a strong case for it. John Fox has to now learn it. I liked Fox ever since his work with the Panthers started. He shouldn't have dissed the QB like that but in his view, he's never been apart of that 'Spread', but with each passing week, Tebow is making John Fox sleep much better at night. Elway has even been impressed, even though he continues to say "He's yet to impress me", deep down, he knows Tebow has given the team a chance to compete. The RB's are doing there thing as the Defense is sacking, getting turnovers.
Orton was a good QB, but I guess he didn't have the effect that 'Tebow' has to ignite millions, lol.
I miss Champ Bailey truly ... to know we traded him for Portis, it may have been alright back then for some, but Champ has lasted longer. Portis did alot for us, but those wheels got old and with all the muscle he gained, his elite quickness and speed quickly drowned. To watch Champ still lock down the top receivers, it hurts b/c he was a Redskin, but I knew he couldn't stand Snyder and just needed a fresh place to go.
But all in all, Tebow has impressed me. The simple things, as ESPN did a column on the Bronco's offense, clarifying it as 'High School Offense' and the fact that it has killed four team's defenses in a row. Never did I think he would beat the 'Rex Ryan' defense, but he shocked everyone.
That's my 'pocket of change'.
I can appreciate the man's leadership, as he's got the whole team believing he can win for and with them. But it's not Tebow winning these games. It's the Broncos defense. If the defense hadn't put every team the past 4-5 weeks into a lockdown, the fact that Tebow completes 2 passes up until the 4th quarter every week would not work, and everything 'great' being said about him would be the exact opposite.
Broncos defense is saving this team, Tebow's merely the media face for each victory as he's the last one with the ball to make that final 'BIG' TD play or FG set-up that took him 55 minutes to do.
STILL HAVE NO IDEA HOW THE JETS COULDNT FIND A WAY TO SHUT DOWN TEBOW IN THAT LAST DRIVE OF THAT GAME. Unbelievable how you let him keep running, KNOWING he's gonna run it, and he still loops to the outside without a single guy in spy coverage. Just crazy how it's all working out for Denver.
Defense.
Its a bit of both.
Sure, if the Broncos defence (who are playing like a top 3 defence right now) wasn't so dominate that it would eb the exact opposite for Tebow, but then again if Tebow wasn't pulling through with these game winning drives/touchdowns, no one else on the offense is stepping up. Their o-line is average at best, their run game is seemingly non-existent at time (from the backs) and aside from Eric Decker who a fucking stud right now, their WR's are dropping so easy passes (all things with Tebows throwing considered). DeMarius Thomas is god awful, and they let Brandon Lloyd go so thats not going to help any QB, let alone Tebow.
I think Tims leadership and skill set right now for the offense that Denver is running is perfect. He had 8-1 in the TD/INT department so when they do decide to throw he doesnt turn the ball over, 500 rushing yards and 3 touchdowns, and basically winning the Jets/Dolphins games hes doing just fine. Anyone that criticizes him either hates him from college or is a complete idiot in regards to American Football. Seems to me a lot of the media hates him because unlike a Antiono Cromarite/Chad Johnson or a (hate to say it) pre- Eagles Mike Vick and during the offseason gets arrested/has 6 kids/twitter out-bursts, he'll build a hospital in the Philippines or go to Prisons and preach to inmates, his personality is subject to all the hate. Listen, Im a huge Tebow fan, and I think he should tune down his religion in the media thing a bit and stop shoving it in people faces, but if hating a guy based on the fact that hes trying to make the world a better places and improve peoples lives, I think its uncalled for.
It doesnt matter if you throw 4000 yards and 40 TDs and go 6-10, I'd MUCH rather have the leader of my offense have Tim Tebow projected stats (he'll probably finish with like 14 tds 4 picks) but that wins games and makes the playoffs. Its all about winning, and Tebow does that on and off the field.
I like Tebow the person, he is a genuine person which is good to see in sports these days. But the player is a different story. While the team is 4-1 with him at QB lets not get it twisted. The defense has played out of their mind lately and look who their wins are against....Raiders (Pre-Carson), Bills (fallen off), Chiefs (mediocre at best), Jets (they have their own problems at QB)....none of those teams have great offenses nor great defenses. The team they lost to was the Lions who demolished them because they have a dynamic offense. While he has done a good job leading his team to victory just keep in mind the opponents.
I also think its a psychological things with close games which the Broncos D keep them in, teams panic in the 4th knowing its 'Tebow Time'. Psychology plays such an important part in sports. Think in the EPL how many promoted teams win their first game or when a new manager joins a team wins as well.
NFL, NBA etc. no different and thats the impact Tebow is having scaring other teams in those final moments. Well played young fella.
There is something to be said for leadership. It's hard to get amped up to play with a guy like Kyle Orton, who's mediocre on his best day. Tebow just brings something different to the huddle--and it's infectious to the rest of the team, IMO.
Quote from: JustinP on December 01, 2011, 06:11:02 PM
The defense has played out of their mind lately and look who their wins are against....Raiders (Pre-Carson), Bills (fallen off), Chiefs (mediocre at best), Jets (they have their own problems at QB)
For the record, Carson Palmer started the Raiders/Broncos game....Raiders offense was playing very well, exciting game.
I stand corrected, Palmer was playing that game.
Quote from: JustinP on December 01, 2011, 06:11:02 PM
I like Tebow the person, he is a genuine person which is good to see in sports these days. But the player is a different story. While the team is 4-1 with him at QB lets not get it twisted. The defense has played out of their mind lately and look who their wins are against....Raiders (Pre-Carson), Bills (fallen off), Chiefs (mediocre at best), Jets (they have their own problems at QB)....none of those teams have great offenses nor great defenses. The team they lost to was the Lions who demolished them because they have a dynamic offense. While he has done a good job leading his team to victory just keep in mind the opponents.
Although it was actually the Dolphins instead of the Bills that they defeated, I see your point.
Living in Denver, it's crazy to see what has been going on - sure, Tebow's mechanics are still in heavy need of work and a part of me finds the fact that the media always seems to play the "religion" angle far too much on his part, but the guy has managed to do something that Kyle Orton would not be able to do for the life of him currently: win football games when they're on the line.
Granted, since the bye week, the Denver D deserves HUGE kudos (especially Von Miller...if he isn't Defensive Rookie of the Year, I'm calling shenanigans) for stepping up and keeping the team in the game itself but Tebow definitely deserves some praise. A 5-1 record as a starter and bringing a once 1-4 team to a 6-5 record is definitely impressive.
But we'll see how the rest of the season pans out.
Well he threw it today....
200 yards 2 TDS 0 INTS
...oh yeah the most important stat....5-1
The excuses keep getting debunked for the guy.
The latest credit goes to Von Miller's monster season? So Von Miller doesn't play and he does it again! I'm digging this guy more and more every day.
It's also fun to listen to guys like Colin Cowherd and Merril Hoge keep trying to make excuses, even after they keep getting served.
Merril Hoge is the biggest idiot in football.
He said last week he'd cut Stevie Johnson from the Bills because of his touchdown celebration last weekend v/s the Jets, and all of the other panelists just ripped on him.
TEBOW TIME!
This is probably the first time I have ever posted in the American Football forum.
And it's in a Tebow thread.
EVERYBODY's, even mine, interest has been piqued by this guy!
Tebow has proven that God loves football.
I'm in a weird place in my football fandom right now. I've been a Cincinnati Bengals fan since I was knee high to a grasshopper, but I'm more concerned with how Tebow does. For example, the Bengals lost a heartbreaker on a last second drive today, but I'm tickled to death because Tebow won again.
What's wrong with me?
I think Ian should ban Alex in revenge for God making the Bears lose.
Quote from: JackHondo on December 11, 2011, 07:50:03 PM
I'm in a weird place in my football fandom right now. I've been a Cincinnati Bengals fan since I was knee high to a grasshopper, but I'm more concerned with how Tebow does. For example, the Bengals lost a heartbreaker on a last second drive today, but I'm tickled to death because Tebow won again.
What's wrong with me?
Same with me aqnd my brother. My Eagles personally have been done, and his teams the Pats, and we both just stopped what we were doing and watched the Broncos last drive and what happenes.
Hope the win it all
Needless to say, Broncos/Patriots game has potential to be epic with all the factors going in this Sunday.
Also, DJ Steve Porter (he does a ton of remixes with sports clips and all for ESPN) dropped some massive fire involving our subject in question here:
Tim Tebow - "All He Does Is Win" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMK9FKMG3Nc#ws)
Quote from: Chris Strike on December 12, 2011, 12:27:57 PM
Needless to say, Broncos/Patriots game has potential to be epic with all the factors going in this Sunday.
I'm going to that game. :)
Tebow has single handedly gotten me back into football full time. I was in full skeptic mode about the guy when he was drafted but has pulled through in flying colors. Every game this guy plays is exciting and the comebacks this guy has led are going to be the stuff of legend. He has the will to win that guys like Joe Montana and John Elway had. He might not be the best, but he's got the most heart.
Tebow amuses me greatly.
Listen, im one of the biggest Tebow fans, I've been since 06, but that Broncos defence is sick right now. Can you say 2000 Baltimore Ravens?
Broncos Def < 2000 Ravens Def
However
Tebow > Dilfer
Lol
Quote from: Doug E Fresh on December 12, 2011, 11:11:15 PM
Broncos Def < 2000 Ravens Def
However
Tebow > Dilfer
Lol
Exactly, balancing it out....but then again
Jamal Lewis > Willis McGahee
Shannon Sharpe > .....whoever Denvers tight end is
but still, closest comparison I could find.
Von Miller, Champ Bailey, and Elvis Dumervil are on the rampage. Add to it Tebow's comeback heroics, Matt Prater's clutch kicking, and Willis McGahee's career rebirth and it all adds up to something really special.
As much as I like McGahee, hes been trash since his injury tbh
Let's be honest though it was less like Tebow won it and more like the Bears lost it. Marion Barber only needed to stay in bounds and in Overtime just needed to hang onto the football.
I have said it before and I will say it again Football is a very big psychological game and teams are now panicking in the 4th feeding into this Tebow mania. Guys a winner, but it's more the mental fact you see teams panicking than anything else.
He did look very vunerable for 3 and a half quarters against the Bears whos offense is shit. Put someone like the Pats on the otherside of the ball with a cool, calm and collective Tom Brady...different story.
What about that horrible Pats pass defense that's giving up over 300 yards a game? They're not that great. Offensively the Pats are elite. Defensively they're near the bottom especially on pass defense.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on December 13, 2011, 05:52:40 PM
What about that horrible Pats pass defense that's giving up over 300 yards a game? They're not that great. Offensively the Pats are elite. Defensively they're near the bottom especially on pass defense.
And from a passing attack point of view Tebow only started to move the ball in the later stages of the 4th quarter. The stat line was something ridiculous like he was 3-14 or something for the first three quarters and then actually did something in the 4th. Unless the Broncos gear their offense to do something early in the game in the air the Pats will have run away with it by then.
Quote from: Trumpers on December 13, 2011, 06:13:40 PM
And from a passing attack point of view Tebow only started to move the ball in the later stages of the 4th quarter. The stat line was something ridiculous like he was 3-14 or something for the first three quarters and then actually did something in the 4th. Unless the Broncos gear their offense to do something early in the game in the air the Pats will have run away with it by then.
Given the factors, I honestly think we might be in for a shootout bout similar to how Denver/Minnesota was two weeks ago...but yeah, Denver's play calling on offense is definitely going to have to be a bit more aggressive against the Pats IMO. Because the Patriots offense, well...they find a way of putting up points on the board.
I really think the Bronco's 4th success has to do with the first three quarters. The Broncos absolutely grind out the defense and by the 4th quarter they are gassed. It's not Tebow by himself that winning, it's the running game. They grind the run, and then they throw in a long pass play once in awhile. It's a very patient offense, but IMO it probably wouldn't be possible without the defense.
Broncos/Pats is going to be a shoot out.
I'm going to say is Dawkins is out, it'll be a shoot out, their secondary lacks leadership/experience without him, and will give up big plays, but I cant see this game going over a 17-14 score line or something like that. Can the freak athlete Von Miller contain Gronkowski? Champ can cover Welker, but Gronkowski is the best RECEIVER in the league right now, and is as hot as Moss was when he caught 21 a few years ago.
I'll vote against it being a shoot out, but I do think Tebow suffers a set back here.
I think Tebow's reputation as a winner takes a hit, but not him and his development. He doesn't get rattled off the field, so I think even if he gets destroyed, he comes out of it with a "lessons learned" type of attitude and builds on it.
Quote from: Talon on December 15, 2011, 01:33:33 AM
I think Tebow's reputation as a winner takes a hit, but not him and his development. He doesn't get rattled off the field, so I think even if he gets destroyed, he comes out of it with a "lessons learned" type of attitude and builds on it.
I don't see how his reputation as a winner can take a hit to be honest. Surely everyone is not expecting him to win every single game and this is the Patriots a very, very good football team. Plus he has already beaten some very good teams this year as well. Guy is a winner first and foremost, he is not a typical NFL quarterback and I throw a football better than him lol, but at the end of the day he is delivering wins and he has people tuneing into Broncos games so for me thats a massive plus for the Denver organization all around.
That and he looks very difficult to bring down...pretty exciting when he is on the run, more so than Vick I feel...maybe not as much as the pioneer Randall Cunningham :)
I agree with Ian, when Tebow runs, theres a je ne sais quoi that makes him more exciting than Vick. Vick dances around and makes defenders look foolish, but when Tim runs hes a power back....hes as big as most LB's in the game, and anytime hes up against a corner he'll run them over.
I dont know, maybe its when Tebow runs I dont fear that he'll get hurt and ruin our season....like this season VICK!
I disagree...
I think Vick is far more exciting when he is on the run then Tebow.
Tebow gets exciting when he throws the football.
But today I was talking with my buddies, looking at the current QB's in the league, Tebow is middle of the pack in my books. Starting from top to bottom, QB's Tebow is better than:
Matt Moore -- Dolphins
Mark Sanchez --- Jets
Joe Flacco --- Ravens (depends what Flacco shows up I suppose)
Colt McCoy -- Browns
C.J. Yates --- Texans
Blaine Gabbert --- Jags
Dan Orlovsky --- Colts
Tyler Palko --- Chiefs
Rex Grossman --- Redskins
Caleb Haine --- Bears
Cam Newton --- Panthers (about the same IMO)
Josh Freeman --- Bucs (THIS season)
Alex Smith --- 49ers (Similar to Tebow, niners limit his passes so he doesnt make mistakes, but Tebow can move the ball without a Vernon Davis/Crabtree, Smith cant do it.)
Tavaris Jackson --- Seahawks
John Skelton --- Cards
Sam Bradford --- Rams (based on this season only, Bradfords been horrendous, but I feel bad cause everyone by Lloyd went down at WR)
So all debates aside, Tebow is far from the worst qb in the league like many disbelievers think.
Quote from: Cory on December 16, 2011, 02:06:09 PM
But today I was talking with my buddies, looking at the current QB's in the league, Tebow is middle of the pack in my books. Starting from top to bottom, QB's Tebow is better than:
Matt Moore -- Dolphins
Mark Sanchez --- Jets
Joe Flacco --- Ravens (depends what Flacco shows up I suppose)
Colt McCoy -- Browns
C.J. Yates --- Texans
Blaine Gabbert --- Jags
Dan Orlovsky --- Colts
Tyler Palko --- Chiefs
Rex Grossman --- Redskins
Caleb Haine --- Bears
Cam Newton --- Panthers (about the same IMO)
Josh Freeman --- Bucs (THIS season)
Alex Smith --- 49ers (Similar to Tebow, niners limit his passes so he doesnt make mistakes, but Tebow can move the ball without a Vernon Davis/Crabtree, Smith cant do it.)
Tavaris Jackson --- Seahawks
John Skelton --- Cards
Sam Bradford --- Rams (based on this season only, Bradfords been horrendous, but I feel bad cause everyone by Lloyd went down at WR)
So all debates aside, Tebow is far from the worst qb in the league like many disbelievers think.
In terms of what? Because a ton of these quaterbacks are WAAAAYYYY better than Tim Tebow. If it's just on wins the guy hasn't even had a full season yet...and if it is on that I'd have Skelton over him given the fact Tebow has a much better defense around him and more playmakers on offense.
Cam Newton is three times the QB that Tebow is...and I'd take Bradford, Flacco, Sanchez and Josh Freeman over Tebow any day of the week as well...twice on Sundays.
I really struggle to see how Tebow is better than half this list as for the rest, most of them are either rookies or guys who are backups thrust into the limelight.
When you debated this with your mates did anyone say "Ummm what you been smoking Cory?" lol
This is the list we all had come up with, QB's I kinda put a bracket by I could see room for debate, but yeah. I think as a whole, Tebows ability to actually win close games v/s Cam's playing ability balances them out. Newton turns the ball over far too much for me to say I'd take him over Tebow. Both are excellent runners, both need to work on their mechanics, but the fact that Newton has lost every close game this year, and Tebow has excelled is why.
Flacco/Bradford/Freeman Im basing off this season. If i'm taking it off a career, Bradford/Freeman last season hands down are way better than Tebow, but this year they've been complete shit. Freeman turns the ball over WAY to much for the weapons he has (Benn/Williams/Winslow) and Bradford has Steven Jackson to carry his load and Brandon Lloyd and still can't be as productive as Tim Tebow with ....Eric Decker and 3 different running backs. Flacco is awful. He'll have one 3 TD, 300 yards game, and then vanish. Do you need to look at his last playoff run? He could barley throw for over 100 yards in a game. As I mentioned, when Flacco is on top of his game, better than Tebow. What he is averaged out a whole season, he's equal to Tebow at best.
Sanchez is probably the worst full time starting QB in the league. His mechanics still need work, but that will happen from a young player coming out of college too early, but he has THE worst decision making in the NFL. He is the sole reason why their not a playoff team this year, and has cost them more games than Romo has cost the 'Boys over the last two seasons.
I'd take Tebow over all of these QB's, with the exception of maybe Sam Bradford/Cam Newton.
Just to elaborate statistically, when it comes to winning games this season, Tebow is better than everyone on the list, just statistically speaking (both passing and rushing):
Tim Tebow --- 13 Touchdowns, 5 Turnovers (Weapons: Eric Decker, DeMarius Thomas, Willis McGahee)
Cam Newton --- 28 Touchdowns, 18 Turnovers (Weapons: Steve Smith, Greg Olsen, DeAngelo Williams)
Mark Sanchez --- 26 Touchdowns, 15 Turnovers (Weapons: Santionio Holmes, Plaxico Burres, Shonn Greene)
Joe Flacco --- 15 Touchdowns, 14 Turnovers (Weapons: Anquan Boldin, Torrey Smith, Ray Rice)
Colt McCoy --- 14 Touchdowns, 13 Turnovers (Weapons: Josh Cribbs, Ben Watson, Peyton Hillis)
Josh Freeman -- 15 Touchdowns, 19 Turnovers (Weapons:Mike Williams, Kellen Winslow, LeGarette Blount)
Sam Bradford --- 6 Touchdowns, 13 Turnovers (Weapons: Brandon Lloyd,Brandon Gibson, Steven Jackson)
So Tebow statistically this year, only Sanchez and Newton have significantly more touchdowns, but both have at least triple the turnovers, and far superior offensive weapons that what Tebow has. Newton has probably the best running back tandem in the NFL to hand the ball off too and keep the defense guessing and Sanchez has a top 3 o-line, yet all of those turnovers?
QB mechanics mean nothing if you turn the ball over and cost your team the game.
Tebow has the worst passing completion percentage then all of them. You seem to have missed that stat.
Tebow... who rarely throws... also has fumbled more times then Cam Newton on less carries. Tebow also only averages 6.5 yards per attempt, one of the lowest in the NFL... which means a lot of his passes are on short routes... which doesn't explain his worst completion percentage.
I would take Tebow over some of those quarterbacks you listed... but not because he is a better quarterback... but because he has this will to win and he makes other players around him better players. Cam Newton on the same level as Tim Tebow... that is laughable.
There is no question Tim Tebow is a good football player. He just isn't a good quarterback.
Quote from: DnK on December 17, 2011, 12:51:53 PM
Tebow has the worst passing completion percentage then all of them. You seem to have missed that stat.
Tebow... who rarely throws... also has fumbled more times then Cam Newton on less carries. Tebow also only averages 6.5 yards per attempt, one of the lowest in the NFL... which means a lot of his passes are on short routes... which doesn't explain his worst completion percentage.
Yet again to counter...
Turnovers > Low completion percentage. I'd much rather my QB go 8 for 18 with 2 TDS 0 Picks than 24-48 with 2 TDS and 4 Picks
Wins > Low completion percentage
Steve Smith, Greg Olsen, Williams/Stewart > Eric Decker, Lance Ball/Willis McGahee and uhh..
Then average yards per carry? LMFAO....So your trying to compare Newton who also has Williams/Stewart in the backfield which means a few things. A) Newton is a better passer then Tebow, so defenses play MUCH more coverage then v/s Tebow so a lot of Cam's runs aren't vs Blitz, whereas in the Option there's a very high number of blitz plays called. B) Play action for Carolina is MUCH more effective, making it easier for Newton to run on bootlegs. Teams focus on Williams/Stewart and dont QB contain & when they give Newton a chance to run he takes it. Tebow runs the option which means there's almost always a linebacker or two purely assigned to QB contain, making it more difficult to run as opposed to having a effective play action.
Saying Cam Newton is on a different level than Tebow is laughable.
Cam Pros: Better mechanics, more explosive, more athletic, much better offensive players around him
Cons: TURNOVERS, Not clutch (will improve with experience), predictable (teams know how to stop him)
Tim Pros: Doesn't turn the ball over, tougher runner, clutch, unpredictable (no d-coach has figured out how to stop him yet)
Cons: Mechanics (will improve with experience)
I havent once said that Tebow is a better QB than the others based on stats alone, but for you guys saying "ill take _____ over Tebow any day of the week", if Tebow had the weapons that Cam Newton, Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez have, well.....
In terms of who is a better quaterback I'd go Newton any day of the week. Guy is a tremendous athelete and has the right mechanics to be a great NFL QB and how can you argue with those rushing TD numbers.
It depends how you measure if Cor, Tebow is a winner and when it all boils down to it that is what counts. In terms of who is the better QB, Tebow is low on that list. The guy has a horrible action in terms of throwing and I think the credit of these wins also have to go to a lot of the Broncos. He also has a lot stronger weapons than you give them credit for.
I am kind of on the fence with him. If he keeps winning, how can you argue his impact? Fact is he needs to keep doing this because if he doesnt as a stand alone QB the guy is pretty poor. I appreciate the poor kid is under an intense spotlight which he has dealt with very well and I don't blame him at all for the eye rolling BS of NFL.com and all these sports shows all over his nut sack every day.
One thing we can all agree on at the midpoint of the season he has been a great talking point. Added to that, the guy I think is a fantastic model of what a professional athlete should be about. Faith is of course subjective...but nice to see someone stood there proud of who they are and being positive rather than all the negatives usually associated with professional sports players.
Quote from: Jack Benevolence on December 18, 2011, 04:24:43 PM
Something that I think would be interesting to see is what would people's reactions be if he started to lose a number of games in a row. Outside of more hardcore football fans, anyone paying attention seems to love the guy and can't stop talking about him. I wonder how many games he would have to stink up before all the love he is getting turns in to hate.
Granted, he may never start stinking up the place...but it would be an interesting thing to watch.
Thats kind of where I am coming from mate. Say for example Carson Palmer if the Raiders are a losing team, nobody can really say he is a shit QB. He has a great arm and can change a game around as well as a respect leader. You look at Tebow...if he cant win, what value at the QB position does he have to any team.
Tebows team isnt helping him at all today.
Best game I have seen him play if I am honest as a passer.
I thought Tebow played his best game of the season today. Other then the fumble, which is the only really negative I play I saw. He did a lot of really good things and looked good throwing the football.
The loss isn't on him that's for sure... but if the media will most likely blame him for the most part. But if you get all the credit when you didn't deserve it... then you have to be able to handle to blame, even when you don't deserve it.
Tom Brady is the shit. That is all.
I think the game v/s Minnesota was the best example of his passing, or maybe count the 4th against the Bears, but he didn't get help from anyone out there today.
Look forward to him bouncing back next week though with a W
How can you say he didn't get any help? The team ran for a total of 252 yards, and he accounted for 92. He did enough passing to help keep the Patriots defense honest. The problem is they played a better team and got beat. Its as simple as that. If you look back at their 7 game winning streak the average record for their opponents is .440...that's a losing record. They weren't playing quality teams, except for the Bears who are without Cutler of course. He only completed 50% of his passes, which he is going to have to become more accurate than that.
Quote from: JustinP on December 19, 2011, 09:04:40 AM
How can you say he didn't get any help? The team ran for a total of 252 yards, and he accounted for 92. He did enough passing to help keep the Patriots defense honest. The problem is they played a better team and got beat. Its as simple as that. If you look back at their 7 game winning streak the average record for their opponents is .440...that's a losing record. They weren't playing quality teams, except for the Bears who are without Cutler of course. He only completed 50% of his passes, which he is going to have to become more accurate than that.
The fumble at the end of the first half was a nightmare...one of the worst plays all year, and the o-line had its worst game since the Lions loss. McGahee got hurt and Lance Ball had a costly fumble too (Tebow has one as well). The defense shit the bed, but like I said earlier in the week I believed the Pats were going to win, just didn't think Broncos would give up 41.
It's because they finally played a high quality team whose offense is hard to stop by any defense in the league.
Quote from: JustinP on December 19, 2011, 12:24:38 PM
It's because they finally played a high quality team whose offense is hard to stop by any defense in the league.
What about the Lions? Their offense is kicking ass so this isn't the only good offense they've played since he took over. They also beat a Jets team that is in playoff contention and San Diego which murdered the Ravens on Sunday Night Football. I was at the game (Pats/Broncos) and the fumbles were the difference. The game possibly would've been an OT game if it wasn't for that. They basically handed the Pats 17 points with those mistakes. It's not all just Tebow and this game showed that. He wasn't the reason why they lost. In fact he almost ran for 100 yards and had close to 300 yards of total offense. I'm going to type up a full report on the game to post here tomorrow but bottom line is that the fumbles were the difference. My opinion on Tebow is that he isn't the best quarterback out there but he is entertaining to watch, he's a locker room leader, and "all he does is win" to quote Stephen A. Smith. He's got a winning record as a starter and if he's winning games then I don't see what the big deal is. The guy wins games for his team and the big thing to look at is how the team was doing before he took over the team. They were 6-22 if I'm not mistaken before he was named the full starter before he was named the starter. 6-22 compared to 7-2 with Tebow. That was one of the worst if not the worst in the league. If they're winning games now and they weren't before then I'd say there's nothing but positive. Plus add to it all the media attention which I'm sure is helping their revenue stream so having the guy on their team is good on all accounts. Also Tom Brady is amazing. He's like a surgeon on the field slicing through the opposing defense. Now to add to this I've found some amusing videos with Tebow debates I've found on Youtube. These are all very amusing.
Skip Bayless vs. Chris Carter - Fight and Heated Tebow debate (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGFoLPqT7L0#ws)
Are you sold on Tim Tebow? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KG8QMnBNHk#ws)
The Most Heated Debate Over Tim Tebow (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0Vdukz1CY8#)
Consistency is the difference. The Pats have been good all season and are a more complete team. Sure, they give up a lot of yards on defense, but hold opponents from scoring as much as they should. All those teams you have mentioned have been all over the place all year and at the time the Broncos played them, they were usually in some sort of slump. The guy is a winner, but to say he is the only reason the Broncos are doing so well is asinine considering how good the defense has been to keep them in games and to set them up in the position to win the game at the end.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on December 21, 2011, 12:18:54 AM
It's not all just Tebow and this game showed that.
Did you miss this part? The defense has been playing well but that team needs a leader. Tebow has proved that. Look at how they are now compared to how they were when Orton was still the quarterback. The Pats are a more complete team, yes, but they have an elite level coach and an elite level quarterback. Denver changed their entire system during their Bye week and changed starting quarterbacks. A team that goes to a Run First offense and changes quarterbacks and running backs (Willis McGahee replaced Knowshon Moreno), basically an entirely new system, should not be having this much success. I think Orton was not a good fit for that team but Tebow has the perfect mentality to lead them on offense. On defense the injection of Von Miller has done wonders.
I was generally speaking, not necessarily responding to just your post. A lot of people have acted as though Tebow is the only reason they are winning. But rest assure, that it won't last long. He is the biggest sports story this year, but when next year rolls around all of the hoopla and craziness will be gone and reality will settle in when they have a losing record next year and the offense won't be able to do anything.
It'll also depend on their schedule. Strength of schedule plays a big part in how a team does.
I think it was so fitting that the team to beat the Packers was a Kyle Orton lead Chiefs team.
I think it'll be hilarious if somehow, the Chiefs win the AFC West over the Broncos in Week 17.
That could happen even with Orton as the starter but frankly he's not that great and he'll Ortonize the Chiefs offense to the point where they wont make the playoffs. However Romeo Crennel is the real wild card. This guy can coach. Look at what he's done with a crap team in one week. They're playing like they did when the made the playoffs last year and not how they've been playing this year.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on December 21, 2011, 08:16:43 PM
That could happen even with Orton as the starter but frankly he's not that great and he'll Ortonize the Chiefs offense to the point where they wont make the playoffs. However Romeo Crennel is the real wild card. This guy can coach. Look at what he's done with a crap team in one week. They're playing like they did when the made the playoffs last year and not how they've been playing this year.
What do you mean... even with Orton as the starter? Kyle Orton is a good quarterback... which makes me laugh that Denver just got rid of him. They could have traded him for at least a late first round pick in return. The reason the Broncos were losing was not Orton's fault. I think if you ask most teams, they'll take a QB who throws for as many yards as Orton does with his TD to INT ratio any day.
^^^ really wanted him to come to Washington for that stat ratio :(
Chiefs D' looked great against the Pack' ... Two words ... Tamba Hali ... that dude balls all day long!
Quote from: DnK on December 21, 2011, 08:22:02 PM
What do you mean... even with Orton as the starter? Kyle Orton is a good quarterback... which makes me laugh that Denver just got rid of him. They could have traded him for at least a late first round pick in return.The reason the Broncos were losing was not Orton's fault. I think if you ask most teams, they'll take a QB who throws for as many yards as Orton does with his TD to INT ratio any day.
LOL
Quote from: DnK on December 21, 2011, 08:22:02 PM
What do you mean... even with Orton as the starter? Kyle Orton is a good quarterback... which makes me laugh that Denver just got rid of him. They could have traded him for at least a late first round pick in return. The reason the Broncos were losing was not Orton's fault. I think if you ask most teams, they'll take a QB who throws for as many yards as Orton does with his TD to INT ratio any day.
Denver got rid of him... BECAUSE HE SUCKS! He was 12-21 as their starter in Denver however when you factor in that he started 6-0 that means he went 6-21 after that as a starter after that first run. How is that a good quarterback? Without the Chicago Defense backing him up he's done nothing in the NFL. Even with that he had the lowest QB rating in the NFL his first year and has been average at best since then. Don't even get me started on his first year as the starter in Denver after the Cutler trade. He led that team to one of the biggest choke jobs of all time. Denver started 6-0 and then went 2-8 to miss the playoffs. His overall starting record is 34-33 including last week and most of that was with Chicago back when they had a top tier NFL defense. Orton is a middle of the road quarterback and always will be. Not Orton's fault? Look at the team since he left. I'd say a lot of it was his leadership on offense. Look at them now with Tebow. Same team, HUGE difference. Orton was not a good fit for that team and it showed. The moment Tebow took over the offense had belief in themselves and it showed on the field. The defense was energized by that too so the whole team's demeanor changed and it showed on the field with how they've been playing since the change was made. Orton's best year had 20 TDs and 9 INTs but the team was 3-10 with him starting that year. Tebow may not be the best but I'm sure even at his worst he could put up similar numbers plus a high number of rushing yards which he has done already. As far as Orton's yards go the most he's EVER thrown is 3,803 back in 2009. The Brandon Lloyd factor should be added into that equation since Lloyd was a beast back then. The year he did that he wasn't even in the top ten in the league in passing, he was fourteenth. Like I said, he's a middle of the road quarterback, nothing special. That sums it up right there.
To elaborate......
If any team gave up any more than a 3rd rounder for Orton, they should re-evaluate management. Orton has never been anything more....or better than a backup. He was extremely hot for like 6 games last season and then fell off the fucking map.
He wont replace Cassel in KC, he's just a bandaid until Cassel returns.
Quote from: Cory on December 21, 2011, 09:44:17 PM
LOL
Alright, I was being a bit over exaggerate.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on December 22, 2011, 12:06:20 AM
Denver got rid of him... BECAUSE HE SUCKS! He was 12-21 as their starter in Denver however when you factor in that he started 6-0 that means he went 6-21 after that as a starter after that first run. How is that a good quarterback? Without the Chicago Defense backing him up he's done nothing in the NFL. Even with that he had the lowest QB rating in the NFL his first year and has been average at best since then. Don't even get me started on his first year as the starter in Denver after the Cutler trade. He led that team to one of the biggest choke jobs of all time. Denver started 6-0 and then went 2-8 to miss the playoffs. His overall starting record is 34-33 including last week and most of that was with Chicago back when they had a top tier NFL defense. Orton is a middle of the road quarterback and always will be. Not Orton's fault? Look at the team since he left. I'd say a lot of it was his leadership on offense. Look at them now with Tebow. Same team, HUGE difference. Orton was not a good fit for that team and it showed. The moment Tebow took over the offense had belief in themselves and it showed on the field. The defense was energized by that too so the whole team's demeanor changed and it showed on the field with how they've been playing since the change was made. Orton's best year had 20 TDs and 9 INTs but the team was 3-10 with him starting that year. Tebow may not be the best but I'm sure even at his worst he could put up similar numbers plus a high number of rushing yards which he has done already. As far as Orton's yards go the most he's EVER thrown is 3,803 back in 2009. The Brandon Lloyd factor should be added into that equation since Lloyd was a beast back then. The year he did that he wasn't even in the top ten in the league in passing, he was fourteenth. Like I said, he's a middle of the road quarterback, nothing special. That sums it up right there.
LOL... he doesn't suck. No, he's not a Tom Brady or a Drew Brees... but he is a middle of the pack NFL Quarterback. He's better then a lot of people give him credit for and he didn't deserve all that crap Bronco fans gave him, that's for sure.
I don't know how to explain why the Broncos all of a sudden starting playing defense. If it is truly because Tim Tebow was quarterback and not Kyle Orton... then that is just straight up sad. I tell you what... if the Broncos defense played as good as they have for Tebow (minus the Lions and Pats games) then Orton would have won more games too.
Maybe it's his leadership skills that suck. I don't know that. But he has the tools of a good quarterback. You can take a long look up and down the starting QB's in the NFL and Orton has good career numbers compared to quite a few of them. Orton also went through... what? 4 coaches in Denver?
Quote from: DnK on December 22, 2011, 12:45:03 AM
LOL... he doesn't suck. No, he's not a Tom Brady or a Drew Brees... but he is a middle of the pack NFL Quarterback. He's better then a lot of people give him credit for and he didn't deserve all that crap Bronco fans gave him, that's for sure.
I don't know how to explain why the Broncos all of a sudden starting playing defense. If it is truly because Tim Tebow was quarterback and not Kyle Orton... then that is just straight up sad. I tell you what... if the Broncos defense played as good as they have for Tebow (minus the Lions and Pats games) then Orton would have won more games too.
Maybe it's his leadership skills that suck. I don't know that. But he has the tools of a good quarterback. You can take a long look up and down the starting QB's in the NFL and Orton has good career numbers compared to quite a few of them. Orton also went through... what? 4 coaches in Denver?
Are you serious? Am I going to have to go Skip Bayless on here to get my points across? Firstly he's not better than people give him credit for. His best stats other than the 3,800 passing yards back in '09 are average. As for the Broncos defense they started playing defense because they were winning the turnover battle thanks to the offense. This year Orton threw 8 touchdowns and 7 interceptions as the starter. Tebow on the other hand has kept the turnovers to a minimum and that is why they are winning games. The defense doesn't have to be on the field more because of extra turnovers. Tebow has thrown 11 TDs and only 2 INTs. See the difference there? It's HUGE. It's also a major factor as to why they are winning games. Now you want to talk about career numbers. Let's take a look at them, shall we?
http://www.nfl.com/player/kyleorton/2506444/profile (http://www.nfl.com/player/kyleorton/2506444/profile)
He's thrown for 14,052 yards in his career. However look at the TD-INT stats. 79-55, which is not too good especially since it's a 2-1 ratio meaning for every 2 TDs he's thrown he's thrown at least 1 INT to go with it. Eli Manning has thrown for 164-115 and that's a similar ratio but he's thrown for over 3,000 yards all but his rookie year. Carson Palmer's numbers are very similar to Eli's, almost identical. Alex Smith and Tavaris Jackson are the closest in games started to him and so is Joe Flacco. Thus far, with two games left in this season, Flacco has thrown 79 TDs to 45 INTs and 13,554 yards. However when you factor in that he plays the Steelers twice a year that isn't that bad. Flacco is the best comparison by games played, yards, etc. However he's better than Orton and there's some QBs out there that are way better than him (Brees, Brady, etc.). And finally Orton went through three coaches. He was not there when Shanahan was there and one of those coaches was an interim coach who only coached him for one game. The other three games were started by Tebow.
Tebow had an awful game...
...but Mark Sanchez still played worse. WORST QB IN THE LEAGUE
Tebow had his worst game today in my opinion. However I did see one thing that I liked. Even when things were at their worst they kept throwing the ball. Considering that they had already thrown three interceptions at least they had the guts to keep throwing the ball instead of running it. That surprised me so at least one positive came out of this disaster of a game. In other new Kyle Orton Ortonized the Chiefs offense just like I predicted. And no, Sanchez isn't at Curtis Painter levels of suck yet.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on December 24, 2011, 05:27:25 PM
And no, Sanchez isn't at Curtis Painter levels of suck yet.
Curtis Painter is a back-up and no on expects him to do anything.
Sanchez is the Jets franchise QB, on a legit playoff team, AND is fucking awful.
1-0 Sanchez.
Quote from: Cory on December 24, 2011, 06:18:16 PM
Curtis Painter is a back-up and no on expects him to do anything.
Sanchez is the Jets franchise QB, on a legit playoff team, AND is fucking awful.
1-0 Sanchez.
So you mean he's the new Trent Dilfer? Albeit Dilfer won a Super Bowl but the similarities are there.
Kyle Orton led a comeback against the Raiders and out his team in position to win the game, but the field goal was blocked and he never received another chance. The Chiefs got Ortonized... if that makes you feel better after getting blown out against the god awful Bills.
A week after Tim Tebow actually looked good throwing the football... he took a giant step backwards this week. I'm sure some of it had to do with the cold weather, but he spent way too much time looking in one direction and didn't go through his progressions. He gets one more chance next week to get his team in the playoffs against the Kyle Orton led Chiefs... he better win that game.
I guess if the Chiefs got Ortonized... the Broncos just got Tebowed.
Quote from: DnK on December 24, 2011, 06:41:31 PM
I guess if the Chiefs got Ortonized... the Broncos just got Tebowed.
No, they got Billed. If they miss the playoffs then they will have gotten Tebowed.
.....if the bills didn't get hit with 3 major injuries.....they'd be a playoff team (well, potentially...but strong potential)
Not defending Tebows poor performance, but the Bills aren't really that bad of a football team, just lost Jackson and two major o-lineman.
& next to maybe the Jets, they have a top 5 secondary in the AFC, maybe even top 3, in Florance/Byrd/Wilson
Quote from: Cory on December 24, 2011, 09:27:59 PM
& next to maybe the Jets, they have a top 5 secondary in the AFC, maybe even top 3, in Florance/Byrd/Wilson
Steelers, Texans, Browns, Jaguars, Ravens, Chargers, Jets, Chiefs, Bengals, Titans.... teams in the AFC that allow fewer passing yards per game and that is with the 5th worst rushing defense in the NFL.
Sorry man, totally disagree with the Bills having a Top 5 AFC secondary. A lot of that has to do with how young they are though, well at least Williams and Byrd are and that the Broncos don;t really having any good receivers outside Thomas and maybe include Decker in there.
Tebow got hurt against that mediocre secondary because he was staring down one receiver instead of going through his progressions like he did so well against the Patriots last week. When you do that throughout the game... you get burned sooner or later.
Quote from: Cory on December 24, 2011, 09:27:59 PM
& next to maybe the Jets, they have a top 5 secondary in the AFC, maybe even top 3, in Florance/Byrd/Wilson
http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=TEAM_PASSING&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2011&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=PASSING_NET_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1 (http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=TEAM_PASSING&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2011&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=PASSING_NET_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1)
Yeah, gotta disagree. Bills are MAYBE a top 10 AFC secondary but should be nowhere near the top five.
Quote from: DnK on December 25, 2011, 12:26:44 AM
Tebow got hurt against that mediocre secondary because he was staring down one receiver instead of going through his progressions like he did so well against the Patriots last week. When you do that throughout the game... you get burned sooner or later.
I will agree with you about the Bills having a mediocre pass defense but can't agree with this. Tebow got burned this week because he was making bad throwing decisions not because of going through his progressions. He got better near the end but he rushed too many throws and wasn't checking for pass defenders where he was throwing. It was all about his decision making. Next week he's facing Kansas City which has a better Pass Defense than the Bills which should make things interesting. However Chiefs have a bad Run Defense which will help out with that since Denver is a Run First team.
Quote from: DnK on December 25, 2011, 12:26:44 AM
Steelers, Texans, Browns, Jaguars, Ravens, Chargers, Jets, Chiefs, Bengals, Titans.... teams in the AFC that allow fewer passing yards per game and that is with the 5th worst rushing defense in the NFL.
Sorry man, totally disagree with the Bills having a Top 5 AFC secondary. A lot of that has to do with how young they are though, well at least Williams and Byrd are and that the Broncos don;t really having any good receivers outside Thomas and maybe include Decker in there.
Tebow got hurt against that mediocre secondary because he was staring down one receiver instead of going through his progressions like he did so well against the Patriots last week. When you do that throughout the game... you get burned sooner or later.
I meant that point by the players/talent there, not what overall team has the best pass rank, as a secondary isnt the sole reason for a pass rank. I think George Wilson/Jarius Byrd is only behind Revis/Cromartie, Clark/Polamalu, and Webb/Reed.
Im talking playmakers that force turnovers, Bills are the top AFC team in picks with 20.
So most people in this thread get on here praising Tebow and how good he is and stuff like that but when he has a game where he truly shows how shitty of a quarterback he really is it just barely gets mentioned and the conversation goes to something else. Tebow is not going to be a tenured NFL quarterback. The guy has a 48% completion percentage. Yes, he has 12 TDs to 6 Ints, which is 2-1 which somebody blasted Orton for, but he has also fumbled the ball 11 times this year. On Saturday he just looked lost and was throwing passes he had no business throwing. That will be the Tebow people will see more times than not. Their little magical run is long gone and it will be back to the old Broncos who will not make the playoffs.
And yes....MARK SANCHEZ SUCKS!!
Personally I dont think Mark Sanchez is that bad, I think the expectation on the Jets because of his loud mouth coach is the problem there...
His coach doesn't help matters, but Sanchez just doesn't have what it takes to win a Super Bowl and with the talent they have on the team they should be in contention every year.
Sanchez leads his team to the AFC Championship game twice in a row, in his first two years, and he sucks? I don't understand the Sanchez hate. He's a good player. He's only been in the league two and a half years. They ARE in contention every year Justin, I don't know what you're smoking.
I don't get the Tebow hate either. He's literally played less then a full year. So what if he can't throw a pass right now? Reminds me of a Superbowl winning QB who couldn't throw either. You might have heard of Rothlisberger, you might not. Obviously he has to have some skills, he won the Heismen right? Nevermind that the Broncos have won more with him then they have lost. His throwing ability will get better.
Jets defense is overrated. Tebow ran over them a few weeks back. So did Philly and the Giants. Eagles torched them. Jets aren't as good as they have been in previous seasons and it's not just Sanchez either.
The Jets defense led them to the AFC Championship game two years in a row. Sanchez did barely enough to not lose some games for them, but now that is coming out this year. He just doesn't have what it takes. When I meant contention, I really meant to be in the Super Bowl. Now their defense has slacked a little which has also brought out Sanchez's shortcomings as a quarterback because he can't put points on the board for his team.
I'm not saying Tebow isn't a good football player, I'm just saying he is a sorry quarterback. At Florida he was able to run all over people, but also pass however we all know the pro and college game is far different. I don't know what kind of point you are trying to make by saying Rothlisberger couldn't pass. His first two years, which were the only two years he has had less than 3,000 yards passing, was when the Steelers were by far a running ream with Jerome Bettis. Rothlisberger is one of the top passers in the league so in my opinion that comparison has no merit. And while the Broncos have won more than lost with him at quarterback we all know that the defense had a large part of that success much like the Jets with Sanchez, plus they haven't played a good quality team.
Sanchez isn't the Jets only problem just like Tebow isn't the Broncos only problem. As for Rothlisberger he had Plaxico Burress, Hines Ward, Santonio Holmes, and Mike Wallace. Those are weapons. Take the weapons away and I don't think Big Ben would be putting up those kinds of numbers. The running game in Pittsburgh is underrated after Bettis left. They've had good runners there most notably Mendenhall. If he had the receiving corps Tebow has right now (a weak one) then the numbers would be similar. The Broncos haven't played a quality team? Patriots, Lions, Bengals, Titans, Packers, Chargers, Jets...yeah, I rest my case.
Sanchez has THE WORST decision making in the league, its like a 12 year old girl is controlling him in Madden or something.
He has 4 good games a year, and the JETS defense is playing poorly because they are aging, but with how often Sanchez turns the ball over, they get gassed very quickly.
Quote from: Cory on December 27, 2011, 08:17:25 PM
Sanchez has THE WORST decision making in the league, its like a 12 year old girl is controlling him in Madden or something.
He has 4 good games a year, and the JETS defense is playing poorly because they are aging, but with how often Sanchez turns the ball over, they get gassed very quickly.
This sums it up about the Jets D and Sanchez right here.
TALK ABOUT TEBOW MORE!
Quote from: JustinP on December 27, 2011, 10:40:02 AM
His coach doesn't help matters, but Sanchez just doesn't have what it takes to win a Super Bowl and with the talent they have on the team they should be in contention every year.
My answer to this is I would say 80 percent of the current NFL QBs couldnt help their team win a Superbowl. If I was to look at the NFL right now with injuries as well...I think there is like
Manning
Big Ben Rothrape
Tommy Tinker Pants
Rivers in the AFC
Brees and Rogers in the NFC
I know you can throw names around like Stafford, Ryan, Vick, Cutler and Shaub as decent QBs, but the above 6 would be the top of my team of winners at the QB position who can actually play Quaterback.
NFL is in a sorry state with regards QBs generally I feel with only maybe Dalton and Newton standouts for me in the last 2 years and thats being generous.
That to me says that Sanchez doesnt have to be a premium QB in order for the Jets to win and bearing in mind a lot of the options elsewhere in the rest of the NFL teams...I dont think he is that bad.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on December 27, 2011, 04:00:34 PM
Sanchez isn't the Jets only problem just like Tebow isn't the Broncos only problem. As for Rothlisberger he had Plaxico Burress, Hines Ward, Santonio Holmes, and Mike Wallace. Those are weapons. Take the weapons away and I don't think Big Ben would be putting up those kinds of numbers. The running game in Pittsburgh is underrated after Bettis left. They've had good runners there most notably Mendenhall. If he had the receiving corps Tebow has right now (a weak one) then the numbers would be similar.The Broncos haven't played a quality team? Patriots, Lions, Bengals, Titans, Packers, Chargers, Jets...yeah, I rest my case.
I guarantee you that if Tebow had that receiving corp he still wouldn't complete 50% of his passes. The man is not accurate. So don't blame that on his receiving corps. I didn't say the Broncos haven't played quality teams, I said they haven't beat any quality teams. They beat the Bengals with Orton at quarterback. With Tebow as quarterback they'v beaten Miami, Oakland, KC, Jets, San Diego, Minnesota and the Bears. All of those are mediocre teams at best this year. The Bears were a good team until Cutler went down. The two best teams on paper, Jets & Chargers have been wishy washy all season long. Now look at the games they have lost...Raiders, Chargers,
Lions,
Patriots,
Bills, Titans and Packers. The ones in bold are the games they lost with Tebow at quarterback. Lions and Patriots are playoff teams with the Bills mired in another losing record and they tore Tebow apart. The only credit I can give Tebow is the Broncos won against the Raiders and Chargers when Orton didn't...but again only mediocre teams.
Mediocre teams? KC, Jets, Chicago, San Diego, and Oakland all were still in the playoff race up until last week and two of those teams still are. Mediocre teams are the norm this season. How hard is that to see? Look at the entire league. It's mostly mediocre. So don't give me this "they've only beaten mediocre teams" crap because a lot of the teams in the league fit that description. That's a BS argument this season and it's very easy to rip apart considering how bad most of the league is thanks to a lack of an offseason.
Interesting article on NFL.com about how defenses should deal with Tebow.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82586a37/article/defenses-coming-up-with-blueprint-for-tebow-time-to-run-out?module=HP11_cp (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82586a37/article/defenses-coming-up-with-blueprint-for-tebow-time-to-run-out?module=HP11_cp)
Does this mean Tebow Time is over?
Quote from: DnK on January 01, 2012, 09:44:25 PM
Does this mean Tebow Time is over?
Tebow Time was about causing other teams to panic and intimidation as I said...
...make him throw the ball and keep calm which is what the Chiefs did and he couldn't do it.
Well done Kyle Orton.
Missed the game (working) but didnt look like the Broncos couldnt do anything offensive. That falls on everyone, not just Tebow. Naturally though as with (mostly) every team, Tebow needs to take the blame, hes the QB, the general of their offense.
....that being said he got them to the playoffs, which is truly one of the top stories this season. They were dead in the water before he was their starter.
I bet Harrison and Polamalu are licking their chops right now.
To sum it up, Tebow had a horrible game. Orton didn't have a great game either. He passed for less than 200 yards. However the Chiefs couldn't do much on offense after the Bowe injury but their one early score was enough. This game was all defense for both teams. It's going to be interesting to see how they do against the Steelers next weekend.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 02, 2012, 12:33:05 AM
To sum it up, Tebow had a horrible game. Orton didn't have a great game either. He passed for less than 200 yards. However the Chiefs couldn't do much on offense after the Bowe injury but their one early score was enough. This game was all defense for both teams. It's going to be interesting to see how they do against the Steelers next weekend.
Lose? Badly?
You mean to the Steelers?
yes
I think it'll depend on how healthy Mendenhall and Big Ben are considering how they did today against the Browns who aren't that good on offense.
Quote from: Cory on January 01, 2012, 11:31:40 PM
Missed the game (working) but didnt look like the Broncos couldnt do anything offensive. That falls on everyone, not just Tebow. Naturally though as with (mostly) every team, Tebow needs to take the blame, hes the QB, the general of their offense.
Yep, the 145 yards rushing by McGahee was nothing on offense. LOL... no, the reason the offense didn't score was ALL of Tebow's fault. I don't even remember any receiver dropping a ball in the game, that's how bad his throws were. And the Chiefs defense did a great job of containing Tebow so he couldn't run.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 02, 2012, 12:43:17 AM
I think it'll depend on how healthy Mendenhall and Big Ben are considering how they did today against the Browns who aren't that good on offense.
I don't think it will be a blowout by any means, the Broncos have a good defense... but I also wouldn't be surprised if the Broncos put up a goose egg in the game.
Tebow needs to pass the ball like he did against Minnesota and they will win. If he doesn't they will lose. This week proved that.
It's time for everyone to get off of Tebow's nuts now. I told you it wouldn't last. Every season their is some type of sensational story for all professional leagues and the Bronco's winning streak was it. Now that it is over the real Tebow is not standing up.
Who?
Actually it's not over until next weekend Justin. He did help get them to the playoffs which is something that shocks me after how badly their season started.
Yep, Mendenhall is out with a torn ACL. That might be a factor as far as the Steelers offense is concerned especially with Big Ben's ankle issues.
I think the fact that Tebow got them to the playoffs means that his season was a success.
He did get them into the playoffs, but he is a horrible quarterback and will prove that again against the Steelers and next year as well, especially since teams will have more time to prepare for their option attack.
Oh and Mark Sanchez does suck!
Quote from: Cory on January 02, 2012, 10:56:12 PM
I think the fact that Tebow got them to the playoffs means that his season was a success.
Agreed. After starting 1-4 just making it to the postseason is a huge success considering where they started from.
Quote from: Cory on January 02, 2012, 10:56:12 PM
I think the fact that the Broncos defense got them to the playoffs means that the Broncos season was a success.
Fixed it for you.
Quote from: DnK on January 03, 2012, 12:32:18 PM
Fixed it for you.
Bollox
The Broncos D has always been good, not amazing, not below par.
it amazes me how teams haven't been able to counter Tebow so far.
The guy has something, but that something isnt a starting QB something
Quote from: DnK on January 03, 2012, 12:32:18 PM
Fixed it for you.
Cause that defense scores points and comesback in the 4th quarter.
I've never ONCE said that their defence isnt the main reason why they started winning with Tebow, because it is. But Tebows was put in a situation, 1-4, where at BEST he was supposed to just see if he could actually play in the NFL and the Broncos wanted to know where they stood before the next draft and offseason. Tebow then went 7-4 and got this lifeless team:
A) Media buzz
B) Win the division (Homefield in the wildcard round)
C) To the playoffs
Tebow was a top 10 QB statistically this year because he had the only stat that mattered and thats wins and getting to the playoffs.
Quote from: DnK on January 03, 2012, 12:32:18 PM
Fixed it for you.
Broncos made the playoffs after starteing 1-4. Changing out Moreno and Orton with Tebow and McGahee did wonders. Their Defense is underrated but not too great especially with Dawkins out and Miller playing with an injured hand.
Moreno got hurt.
Quote from: Blade on January 03, 2012, 12:57:04 PM
Bollox
it amazes me how teams haven't been able to counter Tebow so far.
They have. 3 losses in row has shown that... most likely to be 4 in a row too.
Quote from: Cory on January 03, 2012, 02:18:21 PM
Cause that defense scores points and comesback in the 4th quarter.
I've never ONCE said that their defence isnt the main reason why they started winning with Tebow, because it is. But Tebows was put in a situation, 1-4, where at BEST he was supposed to just see if he could actually play in the NFL and the Broncos wanted to know where they stood before the next draft and offseason. Tebow then went 7-4 and got this lifeless team:
A) Media buzz
B) Win the division (Homefield in the wildcard round)
C) To the playoffs
Tebow was a top 10 QB statistically this year because he had the only stat that mattered and thats wins and getting to the playoffs.
I agree with you on the fact that Tebow was put in a pretty dire situation where the organization just wanted to see what he could do. The team had media buzz all season from the get go... there was media buzz from the off-season when supposedly Brady Quinn passed Tebow on the depth chart for the 2nd string position. They won the division thanks to some late game heroics by the offense, defense, and special teams... and most of all lots of help from the other crap teams in the division. The Broncos didn't really win the division, as much as they backed into it. It seemed like nobody really wanted to win the AFC West. Winning the division and making the playoffs is the same point.
Tebow is not a Top 10 Quarterback... LOL. Not even by wins. Not even by winning percentage.
Tebow is without a doubt a Bottom 10 Quarterback.
Also... something that made me laugh. Orton in 5 games threw for more passing yardage then Tebow in 14.
Quote from: JustinP on January 03, 2012, 03:21:01 PM
Moreno got hurt.
That happened AFTER they made the change.
Moment of truth today, Im a Steelers fan (of course when my Eagles get eliminated every year) but Im still rooting for Tebow to have a good game.
I want the Broncos to win, and I want Tebow to unquestionably lead that win, so naysayers will have to resort to blaming the Steelers for being a bad team.
Quote from: Cory on January 08, 2012, 12:20:15 PM
Moment of truth today, Im a Steelers fan (of course when my Eagles get eliminated every year) but Im still rooting for Tebow to have a good game.
Then you're a not a true Eagles fan.
Quote from: DnK on January 08, 2012, 12:46:28 PM
Then you're a not a true Eagles fan.
I kind of wondered how you can support two teams...your either in or out as far as I am concerned!
Quote from: Trumpers on January 08, 2012, 12:48:53 PM
I kind of wondered how you can support two teams...your either in or out as far as I am concerned!
Exactly. The fact that it's the Steelers that he's also a fan of makes it even worse.
I knew after I posted that I should have edited 'fan' because it wasn't the correct term. I wear my Reggie White jersey at every playoff game I watch, regardless of the Eagles playing or not, I bleed green, but when they choke every year, I "enjoy" I guess watching the Steelers play.
They play the way the Eagles should, and as long as the Giants dont win im okay with it.
and DnK dont be a cunt, Im one of the biggest Eagles fans around, gone out of my way to pay over $1000 to see them play. Your new so I'll cut you slack, but guys like Midas and BD know im Eagles all the way, and would have understood the
"Moment of truth today, Im a Steelers fan (of course when my Eagles get eliminated every year) but Im still rooting for Tebow to have a good game."
I see Cory's side, every time Dallas lost in the NBA playoffs before last year (:D) I still kept watching and still rooted for a team over the other to win said series.
Why can't you root for other teams? There are 32 NFL teams, what if your team isn't playing? Do you just say fuck it and stop watching football period?
Well my point is, Eagles above all but they lose every year.
I've gone a few years of just moping through the playoffs pissed and not enjoying it, but I figured as long as its not another NFC team, what team can I enjoy watching when the Eagles aren't on? The Steelers. I don't live in Pennsylvania so I dont have a cross-town mentality, hell, Steelers/Eagles aren't even rivals. I may have not have to use "fan" in my earlier post, but I believe enjoying watching a team makes you one to some extent.
I dont want to come off as an asshole, but for a passionate Eagles fan for someone to say I'm not, even over a message board rubs me the wrong way, and DnK came off like a complete dickhead. You have a Oregon State and Penn State userbar in your sig, so by your logic your not a fan of either?
A lot of people in PA are fans of both teams actually. They don't have to terribly of a rivalry.
I HOPE the Broncos win this game. For one I'm a fan and two I HATE the Steelers. Ever since that Super Bowl with the Seahawks I've despised them. They also are missing their Pro Bowl Center Pouncey and Mendenhall as well which might be big factors.
Oh, and before I forget...
Tim Tebow - "All He Does Is Win" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMK9FKMG3Nc#ws)
:)
Quote from: Cory on January 08, 2012, 04:08:58 PM
Well my point is, Eagles above all but they lose every year.
I've gone a few years of just moping through the playoffs pissed and not enjoying it, but I figured as long as its not another NFC team, what team can I enjoy watching when the Eagles aren't on? The Steelers. I don't live in Pennsylvania so I dont have a cross-town mentality, hell, Steelers/Eagles aren't even rivals. I may have not have to use "fan" in my earlier post, but I believe enjoying watching a team makes you one to some extent.
I dont want to come off as an asshole, but for a passionate Eagles fan for someone to say I'm not, even over a message board rubs me the wrong way, and DnK came off like a complete dickhead. You have a Oregon State and Penn State userbar in your sig, so by your logic your not a fan of either?
Sorry, if I came off as a dick. I wasn't attempting too. I have family in PA, which is why I grew up being an Eagles fan and also Penn State. I lived in So Cal though... which is why you'll see I am Lakers/Angels/Ducks fan. I attended college at Oregon State University, which is why I am a fan of them. I actually flew to the Beavers/Lions game a few years ago and wore a Beavers hat and Penn State shirt. Besides that is college... it'd be different if I was a Beaver and Oregon Ducks fan (rivals).... which I compare loosely to this.
The rivalry between the Eagles and Steelers is definitely there. Really only in PA though. I hate the Steelers as much as any team in the NFC East. It's just the way I was taught by my family in PA when I was growing up. You have to hate the Cowboys, Giants, Redskins, and Steelers.
But, if I came off as a dick, I apologize. I wasn't trying to downsize your fandom of the Eagles... I just couldn't understand if you are going to cheer for another team... why it would be the Steelers.
Needless to say... today I am a Tim Tebow fan.
TEBOWMANIA IS RUNNING WILD! This is what's going on in Denver's locker room right now...
Tim Tebow - National Championship Halftime Speech! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NSCbx2dIe4#ws)
TEBOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow.
TEEEEEEEEEEEEEBOW TIME!
Quote from: DnK on January 08, 2012, 04:32:05 PM
Sorry, if I came off as a dick. I wasn't attempting too. I have family in PA, which is why I grew up being an Eagles fan and also Penn State. I lived in So Cal though... which is why you'll see I am Lakers/Angels/Ducks fan. I attended college at Oregon State University, which is why I am a fan of them. I actually flew to the Beavers/Lions game a few years ago and wore a Beavers hat and Penn State shirt. Besides that is college... it'd be different if I was a Beaver and Oregon Ducks fan (rivals).... which I compare loosely to this.
The rivalry between the Eagles and Steelers is definitely there. Really only in PA though. I hate the Steelers as much as any team in the NFC East. It's just the way I was taught by my family in PA when I was growing up. You have to hate the Cowboys, Giants, Redskins, and Steelers.
But, if I came off as a dick, I apologize. I wasn't trying to downsize your fandom of the Eagles... I just couldn't understand if you are going to cheer for another team... why it would be the Steelers.
Needless to say... today I am a Tim Tebow fan.
Like I said, you relatively new to the boards so your not familiar with the teams/users yet, so no worries man.
Anyways, on topic:
Get ready for the "Steelers had injuries" or "he had ONE good game"
STFU
#winning
TEBOW BABY! Where's all that Tebow Hate now? YEAH! I'm pumped up right now. THIS IS GREAT!
Having more than one team is lame. Thats my verdict.
As for Tebow...that was some horrendous defense. Ok throw, but Thomas...he was the man there.
One thing is for sure... nobody can say Tebow doesn't have anyone to throw too. Thomas has turned into a star... and no, it had nothing to do with Tebow.
all I'll say Dirk Nowitzki was Tim Tebow before Tebow.
Tebow did nothing. It was all Thomas.
THOMAS TIME
Thomas and Nicks became stars today. Nicks was the star of the Giants game and Thomas of this game. However Tebow threw better than he ever has before in a NFL game. That's for sure. No INTs or fumbles either which is what he needed to cut down on.
Plus, during the coarse of Tebows winning streak, Thomas was dropping a hell of a lot of passes, which is something you cant do when you have a developing QB like Tebow.
But James is dead on, Tebow shined and D.Thomas became a star after Harrisons very dirty hit on Decker took out the Broncos #1 receiver.
Harrison's very clean hit that he was fined for NOT doing so many times. Geez give him a break.
My last post was tongue and check, Tebow all the way. It'll be something if they can beat the Patriots. Then what? Where's all the hate go? It's going to take an effort like this where Denver scores 3 TDs and a handful of FGs to even come close.
Yeah that Decker hit was a HUGE blow considering how thin they are at receiver to begin with. That helmet to the knee was vicious but legal. It's going to be interesting to see what they do with him out but I think they need to do what the Patriots do with a two tight end formation especially considering they now only have 3 healthy wide receivers and 3 tight ends. Glad Royal and Fells also stepped it up. They didn't do as much as Thomas did but they still did better than their averages. McGahee got 61 yards rushing too which isn't bad considering how good the Steelers Run Defense was for most of the game. Tebow ran for 50 yards too which is just about as good as what McGahee did. What's even more stunning, to me, is that they only got 8 yards in the first quarter and then did all this. To me it was all confidence on Tebow's part. All he needed was his confidence back and he got it back. Denver's Defense stepped it up big time too. Very underrated defense in comparison to some of the other big time defenses in the league. If they play like this next week and Tebow can hold onto the ball without making careless turnovers they have a shot. If not then it's going to be a similar game to their first meeting in Denver a few weeks back.
I'm a Browns fan and with that means I hate hate hate the Steelers so I Tebowed in front of the television before the game started.
Best postgame facebook status:
So apparently God didn't forget about the whole rape thing.
Quote from: Doug E Fresh on January 08, 2012, 11:35:51 PM
Best postgame facebook status:
So apparently God didn't forget about the whole rape thing.
That's why I call him Rapelisberger. :)
Post-game interviews with John Elway and Tim Tebow.
Elway On Broncos' Wild Card Win (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ub-nUTBMcCg#noexternalembed-ws)
Tebow Stuns Steelers (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7PwFaWAlbI#noexternalembed-ws)
Quote from: Doug E Fresh on January 08, 2012, 11:35:51 PM
I'm a Browns fan and with that means I hate hate hate the Steelers so I Tebowed in front of the television before the game started.
Best postgame facebook status:
So apparently God didn't forget about the whole rape thing.
I had a more "cringe worthy and sad but lol worthy" one I saw an hour ago:
"Tim Tebow is the the most famous white Bronco since OJ's truck."
I will give the man credit...he played a heck of game and maintained control of the game.
He looked really good, Happy to see him get the win.
Now if he can slay the mighty Patriots I'll be ecstatic.
Love Tebow, Love John Fox (as a Panthers fan, I always liked him)...
So without a dog in the playoff fight, my original pick (the Texans) and Tebow's Broncos have to be the two teams I'd pull for to make it interesting. If one of them can make it to the super bowl, I'd be very pleased.
I hope the game is slow like every Bronco game, Im not off work till 11 and the game starts at 9 here. Hopefully I can catch it mid way through the 3rd.
Tebowie (1/12/12) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHB0o9lCizQ#ws)
Talk about Tebowmania on ESPN.
Who Is Responsible For Tebowmania? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUNjFuS5MTU#ws)
I expected the Pats to win... but this is getting ugly now.
The real Tim Tebow is back.
Lol, 5 Touchdowns in the first half.
This is all the Broncos defence fault. You put Aaron Rogers on the Broncos and this is still an embarrassing game.
Quote from: Cory on January 14, 2012, 10:41:02 PM
Lol, 5 Touchdowns in the first half.
This is all the Broncos defence fault. You put Aaron Rogers on the Broncos and this is still an embarrassing game.
LOL, the Broncos defense is the only reason they have 7 points.
Uh, have you missed watching the Broncos play? Cmon man, Broncos keep games low scoring so they can put the game in Tebows hands and try and edge it out. Thats their system, they run the ball, kill clock and keep it close. It got them into the playoffs and a unthinkable playoff win from when Tebow started.
6 Touchdowns isn't keeping the game close. Brady is fucking embarrassing the Broncos, and when one aspect of the system works, the team fails. Tebows not going to magically turn into Drew Brees and go shot for shot with Tom Brady. Going down so badly early makes it so that the Broncos offense cant play like the Broncos offense at all. Thats why. Tebows not playing great, but this game is the defenses fault. Didn't even give Tebow a chance.
Quote from: Cory on January 14, 2012, 11:14:41 PM
Uh, have you missed watching the Broncos play? Cmon man, Broncos keep games low scoring so they can put the game in Tebows hands and try and edge it out. Thats their system, they run the ball, kill clock and keep it close. It got them into the playoffs and a unthinkable playoff win from when Tebow started.
6 Touchdowns isn't keeping the game close. Brady is fucking embarrassing the Broncos, and when one aspect of the system works, the team fails. Tebows not going to magically turn into Drew Brees and go shot for shot with Tom Brady. Going down so badly early makes it so that the Broncos offense cant play like the Broncos offense at all. Thats why. Tebows not playing great, but this game is the defenses fault. Didn't even give Tebow a chance.
If you honestly thought the Broncos defense was going to keep the Broncos in the game long enough for Tebow to finally show up in the 4th Quarter... you're smoking some good shit.
The fact that Tebow can't move the ball on the WORST defense in the AFC is the reason they are losing the game. That offense is what's embarrassing.
Quote from: DnK on January 14, 2012, 11:19:11 PM
If you honestly thought the Broncos defense was going to keep the Broncos in the game long enough for Tebow to finally show up in the 4th Quarter... you're smoking some good shit.
5 TDs in the first half isn't anywhere close to the planet of keeping them in the game.
Quote from: Cory on January 14, 2012, 11:26:26 PM
5 TDs in the first half isn't anywhere close to the planet of keeping them in the game.
What did the offense of the Broncos do in the first half against, I will repeat... the WORST defense in the AFC?
9-26 for 136 yards. And yet Cory you blame the defense? Its kind of hard to be competitive when you're always out on the field because your quarterback can't do shit. Tebow sucks...and the Pats are the worse defense in the NFL, not just the AFC.
Quote from: JustinP on January 15, 2012, 12:27:45 PM
9-26 for 136 yards. And yet Cory you blame the defense? Its kind of hard to be competitive when you're always out on the field because your quarterback can't do shit. Tebow sucks...and the Pats are the worse defense in the NFL, not just the AFC.
How the FUCK can he throw completions when he has shit receivers with butterfingers to throw to?! Look at his receiving core. Other than Thomas there was nothing there.
Quote from: DnK on January 14, 2012, 11:19:11 PM
If you honestly thought the Broncos defense was going to keep the Broncos in the game long enough for Tebow to finally show up in the 4th Quarter... you're smoking some good shit.
The fact that Tebow can't move the ball on the WORST defense in the AFC is the reason they are losing the game. That offense is what's embarrassing.
Can anyone stop the Pats offense? NO! And I'm amazed no one hs even mentionned that the Pats were rested going into the game yet the Broncos only had a 6 day week instead of 7 plus flying halfway across the country when that was a factor in this too. But yeah, it's all Tebow's fault. All those injuries were his fault, all the dropped passes were his fault, the offensive line's horrible play was his fault...not happening. Tebow actually didn't play bad. He just didn't have any help except from McGahee.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 15, 2012, 12:56:54 PM
Can anyone stop the Pats offense? NO! And I'm amazed no one hs even mentionned that the Pats were rested going into the game yet the Broncos only had a 6 day week instead of 7 plus flying halfway across the country when that was a factor in this too. But yeah, it's all Tebow's fault. All those injuries were his fault, all the dropped passes were his fault, the offensive line's horrible play was his fault...not happening. Tebow actually didn't play bad. He just didn't have any help except from McGahee.
Only a few teams have slowed the Pats offense down. Brady is just too good. I mean he even had a 48 yard punt. Which is why, if you are a Broncos fan and you thought the defense was going to keep the team in the game, you had to be smoking some shit.
The same thing would have happened even if the Pats played last week as well. Stop kidding yourself.
Tebow did play a bad game, lol. His receivers dropped a few untimely balls, but he also threw a lot of shit balls. Plus his fumble on their first possession set the tone for the rest of the game. He fumbles far too much.
But yes, outside of Thomas, the Broncos has shit for receivers. However, good quarterbacks still find a way to move the football. He didn't have a problem last weekend.
Quarterbacks get the praise when they win and the blame when they lose. That is the way it has always been... it doesn't change because it's Tim Tebow now.
Quote from: DnK on January 15, 2012, 01:23:44 PM
Only a few teams have slowed the Pats offense down. Brady is just too good. I mean he even had a 48 yard punt. Which is why, if you are a Broncos fan and you thought the defense was going to keep the team in the game, you had to be smoking some shit.
The same thing would have happened even if the Pats played last week as well. Stop kidding yourself.
Tebow did play a bad game, lol. His receivers dropped a few untimely balls, but he also threw a lot of shit balls. Plus his fumble on their first possession set the tone for the rest of the game. He fumbles far too much.
But yes, outside of Thomas, the Broncos has shit for receivers. However, good quarterbacks still find a way to move the football. He didn't have a problem last weekend.
Quarterbacks get the praise when they win and the blame when they lose. That is the way it has always been... it doesn't change because it's Tim Tebow now.
Do you actually think a team can stop Brady? No. No team left can stop them so don't even act like it's just the Broncos who wont be able to stop him. Next week whoever plays them is going to be in for a long night too.
The same thing would've happened? Tell that to the Steelers.
That's because last weekend he wasn't playing the team coached by the best coach in football. Belichick is the best there is and keeps proving it year in and year out.
Quartebacks don't always get the praise. Look at the list of Super Bowl MVPs. Are they all Quarterbacks? No. Is every season MVP a Quarterback? No. That argument is outdated. When the Ravens won the Super Bowl back in '01 the defense got the praise and not Trent Dilfer. It's not always the quarterback.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 15, 2012, 01:55:12 PM
Do you actually think a team can stop Brady? No. No team left can stop them so don't even act like it's just the Broncos who wont be able to stop him. Next week whoever plays them is going to be in for a long night too.
The same thing would've happened? Tell that to the Steelers.
That's because last weekend he wasn't playing the team coached by the best coach in football. Belichick is the best there is and keeps proving it year in and year out.
Quartebacks don't always get the praise. Look at the list of Super Bowl MVPs. Are they all Quarterbacks? No. Is every season MVP a Quarterback? No. That argument is outdated. When the Ravens won the Super Bowl back in '01 the defense got the praise and not Trent Dilfer. It's not always the quarterback.
What? Are you not reading what I'm typing. I said only a few teams have
slowed the Pats offense down. Giants, Steelers, Cowboys. How did you get I was just bashing on the Broncos defense? LOL
Tell that to the Steelers, who played on the ROAD and were without their running back and best cornerback. Okay, I will tell them. If Patriots played last week, they still would have thrashed the Broncos yesterday, just like they did in the regular season too. You're delusional.
Sure a few exceptions can be made about the quarterbacks getting praise/blame. I can counter you with a hell of a lot more examples of when they do. With Tim Tebow, that is how it is. Get over it.
EDIT: But I do agree with you, Hoodie is the best coach in the NFL.
Quote from: DnK on January 15, 2012, 02:43:42 PM
What? Are you not reading what I'm typing. I said only a few teams have slowed the Pats offense down. Giants, Steelers, Cowboys. How did you get I was just bashing on the Broncos defense? LOL
Tell that to the Steelers, who played on the ROAD and were without their running back and best cornerback. Okay, I will tell them. If Patriots played last week, they still would have thrashed the Broncos yesterday, just like they did in the regular season too. You're delusional.
Sure a few exceptions can be made about the quarterbacks getting praise/blame. I can counter you with a hell of a lot more examples of when they do. With Tim Tebow, that is how it is. Get over it.
EDIT: But I do agree with you, Hoodie is the best coach in the NFL.
It seemed like you were bashing their defense and rightly so. The Brian Dawkins injury is what killed them. After he got hurt they just weren't the same and it showed. You also left off the Bills, lol. They got 4 INTs on both Brady and Tebow when they played them.
Don't give me that on the Steelers. They should've won the game with that team even with the injuries. Their defense is good enough to have won that game especially with Eric Decker going down leaving Tebow with only Thomas as a reliable receiver to throw to. Steelers won their Super Bowl after winning three road games a few years back and a lot of those players were still on this year's team.
I'm delusional? Pfft. Give me a break. Broncos would've given them a fight the first time if it wasn't for the turnovers. This time they just got killed. I'm calling it right now. Patriots are going to destroy the Ravens next week and then win the Super Bowl. They're the best team I've seen (although Packers/Giants haven't played yet).
OF COURSE quarterbacks will get praise/blame but this is a different league now. Roleplayers are going to be getting more praise and blame than before. It's spread out more and quarterbacks dont get all the heat anymore unless they really suck. Prime example of that is Mark Sanchez.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 15, 2012, 04:40:38 PM
It seemed like you were bashing their defense and rightly so. The Brian Dawkins injury is what killed them. After he got hurt they just weren't the same and it showed. You also left off the Bills, lol. They got 4 INTs on both Brady and Tebow when they played them.
Don't give me that on the Steelers. They should've won the game with that team even with the injuries. Their defense is good enough to have won that game especially with Eric Decker going down leaving Tebow with only Thomas as a reliable receiver to throw to. Steelers won their Super Bowl after winning three road games a few years back and a lot of those players were still on this year's team.
I'm delusional? Pfft. Give me a break. Broncos would've given them a fight the first time if it wasn't for the turnovers. This time they just got killed. I'm calling it right now. Patriots are going to destroy the Ravens next week and then win the Super Bowl. They're the best team I've seen (although Packers/Giants haven't played yet).
OF COURSE quarterbacks will get praise/blame but this is a different league now. Roleplayers are going to be getting more praise and blame than before. It's spread out more and quarterbacks dont get all the heat anymore unless they really suck. Prime example of that is Mark Sanchez.
I'm a Eagles fan, I know how much of an impact Brian Dawkins makes. Not only on the field, but as a leader as well. But I was defending that the blame should not be placed on the Broncos defense for the loss to the Patriots.
And yes, the Steelers should have won the game, even with the injuries... but that "reliable" receiver of the Broncos beat them. You knows things would have been different if Mendenhall and Clark played. Plus Rapelisberger wasn't even 100%. I give all the credit to the Broncos, they won that game when nobody but Bronco fans and Skip Bayless thought they would.
Would've... could've... should've. They didn't. End of story. And yes, they will destroy the Ravens next week. Patriots are in a different league then every other team in the AFC.
Another prime example is Tim Tebow.
Quote from: DnK on January 15, 2012, 04:54:18 PM
I'm a Eagles fan, I know how much of an impact Brian Dawkins makes. Not only on the field, but as a leader as well. But I was defending that the blame should not be placed on the Broncos defense for the loss to the Patriots.
And yes, the Steelers should have won the game, even with the injuries... but that "reliable" receiver of the Broncos beat them. You knows things would have been different if Mendenhall and Clark played. Plus Rapelisberger wasn't even 100%. I give all the credit to the Broncos, they won that game when nobody but Bronco fans and Skip Bayless thought they would.
Would've... could've... should've. They didn't. End of story. And yes, they will destroy the Ravens next week. Patriots are in a different league then every other team in the AFC.
Another prime example is Tim Tebow.
The blame should go on the defense and the offensive line. They both choked in that game. At least Tebow kept trying to get them points near the end despite being down 35 points.
Sure nobody thought they would win but deep down all the Steelers haters were rejoicing over that one. On NFL.com's game center comments section it was the Steelers fans against everyone else which made me happy. Seemed like it was a consensus that the Steelers are the most hated team in the league judging by the diversity of the fan comments (meaning fans of multiple teams agreeing on that).
Patriots are going to win the AFC. That is a given. The playoffs were over the moment they got homefield.
Tebow took a shit team that started 1-4 to the playoffs. That doesn't happen often.
.....I just have one thing to ask as this topic will surly slow down until next season. Im a Tebow fan boy, but I never say he has a good game (bias) when in fact he plays bad, but its a team game. Just cause people have hard ons to hate the guy, The defense shit the bed that game more than Tebow shit the bed on offense. Thats the bottom line, both had bad games, not one player on the Broncos played well, so saying its "end of tebow this", ect, so it must be end of "von miller" & "demaryius thomas" and stuff because everyone played awful, not just him.
Secondly, it seems to me like everyones comparing Tebow to this a "good quaterback would have...." in this thread numerous times. Just who do you have in mind? Tebow is essentially a rookie this year, jumped into the starting role this season. A good quarterback? Ian's hit the nail on the head, theres only a few good QBs in the league, so when you say that, are you trying to compare Tebow to Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady or Drew Brees? I dont think Mike Vick with the Broncos weapons would keep in a shoot out with Brady, nor a Matt Ryan or Ben Roethlisberger or Matt Stafford. So you must be comparing Tebow to someone like Aaron Rodgers or Drew Brees with THEIR OWN weapons keeping with the shootout that was yesterdays game.
Quote from: Cory on January 15, 2012, 09:37:19 PM
.....I just have one thing to ask as this topic will surly slow down until next season. Im a Tebow fan boy, but I never say he has a good game (bias) when in fact he plays bad, but its a team game. Just cause people have hard ons to hate the guy, The defense shit the bed that game more than Tebow shit the bed on offense. Thats the bottom line, both had bad games, not one player on the Broncos played well, so saying its "end of tebow this", ect, so it must be end of "von miller" & "demaryius thomas" and stuff because everyone played awful, not just him.
Secondly, it seems to me like everyones comparing Tebow to this a "good quaterback would have...." in this thread numerous times. Just who do you have in mind? Tebow is essentially a rookie this year, jumped into the starting role this season. A good quarterback? Ian's hit the nail on the head, theres only a few good QBs in the league, so when you say that, are you trying to compare Tebow to Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady or Drew Brees? I dont think Mike Vick with the Broncos weapons would keep in a shoot out with Brady, nor a Matt Ryan or Ben Roethlisberger or Matt Stafford. So you must be comparing Tebow to someone like Aaron Rodgers or Drew Brees with THEIR OWN weapons keeping with the shootout that was yesterdays game.
But when they win you will give Tebow praise like he did everything to win the game. For example, the game against the Steelers, Tebow threw a 10 yard pass, it was the receiver who ran the other 70, stiffed arm one would be tackler and out ran the other, but who gets all the praise? Tebow. During their win streak it was the defense who put them in the position at the end of the game to win it when Matt Prater comes out and kicks the game winning field goal, but despite him not being the kicker or the defense, it is Tebow who gets credit. That is what gets on my nerves.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 15, 2012, 12:56:54 PM
How the FUCK can he throw completions when he has shit receivers with butterfingers to throw to?! Look at his receiving core. Other than Thomas there was nothing there.
I'm not sure we were watching the same game. Yeah, his receivers dropped a pass or two, but did you see most of Tebow's passes? They were either five yards short, ten yards too high, or give yards to the left or right. The man can't throw an out route for nothing. The only pass he can really make is a slant or a seam route. He holds onto the ball way too long and instead of throwing the ball when the receiver makes his break, he throws it after the receiver makes his break and turns his head. You can't do that. You have to trust that your receiver knows the route and put the ball where he should be.
Dropped a pass or two? We we watching the same game? They dropped AT LEAST six passes and most of those were Thomas. He had to hold onto the ball because he got no protection. NONE! That's the truth of the matter. The offensive line choked. That had more to do with all of this than anything else.
You really can't believe Tebow is that good to blame it on everybody but him. 9-26 speaks for itself....the guy can't hit the ocean standing on the beach.
Quote from: JustinP on January 16, 2012, 02:14:46 PM
You really can't believe Tebow is that good to blame it on everybody but him. 9-26 speaks for itself....the guy can't hit the ocean standing on the beach.
Have you even been reading this thread? I'm saying it's not just him so don't even go there.
Also found this gem on Youtube just now...
Skip Bayless/Tim Tebow Farewell (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjjZBIommd4#ws)
But when they lose you blame everybody but him.
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 16, 2012, 02:44:06 PM
Have you even been reading this thread? I'm saying it's not just him so don't even go there.
Also found this gem on Youtube just now...
Skip Bayless/Tim Tebow Farewell (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjjZBIommd4#ws)
LOL, that was from First Take this morning.
Skip Bayless spews so much crap, it makes me tune in each Monday. First Take is slowly becoming my favorite show on ESPN. It;s gonna be tough to overtake PTI though.
First Take is exactly what it's like hanging out with my friends who argue about sports. My one friend is like Skip Bayless except he's totally 100% on the bandwagons of his teams and his teams only as well as the players on said teams. My other friend is like Stephen A. Smith. He's loud, he yells a lot to get his points across, and rips on anybody who needs ripping on as well as calling out my other friend Adam on his bias as it relates to his sports opinions. I'm usually the moderator who instigates this stuff, lol.
A little bit of new information that shouldn't come as a surprise. Tim Tebow has been named the Denver Broncos starter at the start of the next football season. Here's that and another article.
http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_19753106 (http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_19753106)
John Elway says Time Tebow can win from the Pocket
http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_19754194 (http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_19754194)
Teams will know how to better stop the option attack next season which means Tebow is going to have to vastly improve from throwring from the pocket.
Read this. Tebow had rib, lung, and chest injuries during that playoff game. Even the haters have to give him props for this, man. Some quarterbacks wouldn't have even come back on the field after injuries like this. This guy is the type of leader more teams need. Props to the man for showing toughness and heart.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8261adad/article/tebow-suffered-rib-lung-chest-injuries-in-playoff-loss-to-pats?module=HP11_headline_stack (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8261adad/article/tebow-suffered-rib-lung-chest-injuries-in-playoff-loss-to-pats?module=HP11_headline_stack)
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on January 18, 2012, 03:08:41 PM
Read this. Tebow had rib, lung, and chest injuries during that playoff game. Even the haters have to give him props for this, man. Some quarterbacks wouldn't have even come back on the field after injuries like this. This guy is the type of leader more teams need. Props to the man for showing toughness and heart.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8261adad/article/tebow-suffered-rib-lung-chest-injuries-in-playoff-loss-to-pats?module=HP11_headline_stack (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8261adad/article/tebow-suffered-rib-lung-chest-injuries-in-playoff-loss-to-pats?module=HP11_headline_stack)
I've never questioned the kids toughness or heart. He exudes heart and toughness. It's just his skill set at quarterback that I question.
It's like the movie Rudy.
Ara Parseghian: "I wish God would put your heart in some of my players bodies."
^^What DnK said. Nobody's questioning his toughness, heart, and passion for the game.
Hes going to improve....its essentially his rookie season, and hes basically starting at the other end of the career progression that most QBs start at.
Typical 1st round QB: Has the skills, might night a bit of adjusting. Technically sound. Needs to gain composure, professionalism, heart, the ability to win games, leader. QB's tend to take 3-4 seasons before they become this "complete" player if you will. Perfect example, Cam Newton. Statistically the best rookie QB season ever, but they didnt win, he doesnt have composure, and isnt a leader. Eventually the two sides of a quality QB will meet for him to become a complete player.
Tebow: Has the heart, composure, professionalism, nearly unmatched leadership, and the ability to win games. He needs to work on his mechanics. Tebow had the best record for a starting "rookie" QB, won tight games and proved to the entire league hes already a top 5 leader at such a young stage in his career. So what's any different that Cam Newton situation, will Tebow not in 2-3 years hit that same point where most QB's gain the features he already has, expect with NFL level mechanics?
Its like the people that get on QB for his mechanics and poor stats, couldn't people be doing the exact same thing for Cam Newtons wins this year with the Panthers? Their record was just as poor as Tebows stats.
Quote from: Cory on January 18, 2012, 04:29:44 PM
Hes going to improve....its essentially his rookie season, and hes basically starting at the other end of the career progression that most QBs start at.
Typical 1st round QB: Has the skills, might night a bit of adjusting. Technically sound. Needs to gain composure, professionalism, heart, the ability to win games, leader. QB's tend to take 3-4 seasons before they become this "complete" player if you will. Perfect example, Cam Newton. Statistically the best rookie QB season ever, but they didnt win, he doesnt have composure, and isnt a leader. Eventually the two sides of a quality QB will meet for him to become a complete player.
Tebow: Has the heart, composure, professionalism, nearly unmatched leadership, and the ability to win games. He needs to work on his mechanics. Tebow had the best record for a starting "rookie" QB, won tight games and proved to the entire league hes already a top 5 leader at such a young stage in his career. So what's any different that Cam Newton situation, will Tebow not in 2-3 years hit that same point where most QB's gain the features he already has, expect with NFL level mechanics?
Its like the people that get on QB for his mechanics and poor stats, couldn't people be doing the exact same thing for Cam Newtons wins this year with the Panthers? Their record was just as poor as Tebows stats.
First off, you can't teach heart and toughness. You either have it or you don't. It's not something you gain later in your career. And for the record, I think Newton has heart and toughness.
Tebow will get better, sure. I mean, he can't really get much worse throwing the football. He will never be a great passer, he won;t even be a good passer. As long as his team has a good defense, you'll always have a chance at winning the football game. Tebow is clutch, that is something Newton was not this year. But being clutch is something you can gain.
Tebow has a lot going for him though. He is a media sweetheart. The team and the city get huge publicity for having Tebow be the face of the franchise. That equals lots of money. I'm not sure exactly how it all works, but you know the Denver Broncos are reaping some sort of benefits from Tebow being in the sports news 24/7.
What Tebow is good at:
1. He can extend the play.
2. He can run the football.
3. He's a leader on and off the field.
4. He's clutch.
What Tebow can/needs to work on in the offseason to help him next year:
1. Reading the opposing defenses.
2. Passing Accuracy
3. Decision Making
4. Holding on to the football.
Tim Tebow can be an average quarterback in the NFL. He'll never have the stats that the good NFL Quarterbacks have. He won't even have the stats that the average quarterbacks have. But he'll learn his limitations. He'll learn what works well for him and what doesn't. He'll learn composure in the pocket. He'll learn not to get rattled after making a bad play.
The Broncos will get some playmakers at receiving corp for him. Although, I think Thomas (no doubt about it) and Decker will turn out being good receivers in the NFL. They need a TE though, that's a necessity. They need to shore up their offensive line to give Tebow better protection. I think their defense will be even better next year then they were this year, but they could use some much needed depth in the secondary.
That about covers it.
Tebow won a playoff game. Some starters on quality teams can't even claim that so no matter what he's already headed in the right direction.
HAHA
Extra-Ordinary Tebow - John Legend (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpWc3neN3oc#ws)
That's ridiculous. We will see how much people are talking next season when the Broncos are 4-12 and go nowhere.
How can you say that they will do that bad next season? Von Miller/Tebow/Thomas are only going to be get better and progress in this full offseason unlike the last.
I think losing their defensive coordinator to the Raiders could be what destroys them next season.
Plus, theres still free agency and the draft.....the Broncos could put the right players around Tebow and make them an even stronger unit.
Quote from: JustinP on February 03, 2012, 03:21:21 PM
That's ridiculous. We will see how much people are talking next season when the Broncos are 4-12 and go nowhere.
Since you're complaining so much about Tebow what's your team? I bet it's the Raiders or some team like that.
The Broncos have a young core that's only going to continue to grow. Their defense is going to be the key next season especially with losing their coordinator and most likely Brian Dawkins as well. Free agency and the draft will be the key to getting everything in order. Plus Elway is going to be working with Tebow hence why I am optimistic about the offense next season. Also they'll have Knowshon Moreno and Willis McGahee at full strength too.
He's going to be great ... "He's a baller, He's a gamer, He's a shot-caller"
He's so good he did a remake of "The Drive" against the Jets that Thursday Night ... 95 yd drive and he went 92 of it! Rex Ryan even had to kneel down and 'Tebow'!
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on February 04, 2012, 02:11:33 PM
Since you're complaining so much about Tebow what's your team? I bet it's the Raiders or some team like that.
The Broncos have a young core that's only going to continue to grow. Their defense is going to be the key next season especially with losing their coordinator and most likely Brian Dawkins as well. Free agency and the draft will be the key to getting everything in order. Plus Elway is going to be working with Tebow hence why I am optimistic about the offense next season. Also they'll have Knowshon Moreno and Willis McGahee at full strength too.
Moreno is a bust, and they should cut him before they have to start paying him big money/resign. The resurgance of McGahee and a pick up in the offseason maybe a speed back is what they need
Quote from: Cory on February 05, 2012, 01:35:51 AM
Moreno is a bust, and they should cut him before they have to start paying him big money/resign. The resurgance of McGahee and a pick up in the offseason maybe a speed back is what they need.
What they need to do is work out a deal for a young running back that compliments Tebow and have him work with McGahee as a mentor/mentee type of situation. Moreno needs a lot of work but has put up decent numbers at times. The injuries and fumbling the ball are his biggest issues.
and Injuries at running back this early in his career = deadly, add the fumbles and that calls for a trip to free agency. I see them drafting a running back in LaMichael James late or even Lamar Miller out of Miami, someone who is a speedster to compliment McGahee who had a good 3-4 years left in the league, as well as learn from the vet.
Next on the agenda would be a Safety/DB to replace Dawkins and some wide receivers to help out Decker and Thomas. The more weapons the better. Or they could go the Pats route and get some TE monsters.
Quote from: Cory on February 05, 2012, 02:37:58 AM
and Injuries at running back this early in his career = deadly, add the fumbles and that calls for a trip to free agency. I see them drafting a running back in LaMichael James late or even Lamar Miller out of Miami, someone who is a speedster to compliment McGahee who had a good 3-4 years left in the league, as well as learn from the vet.
Great post. I think if LMJ is going to succeed in the NFL, it's going to be in that Tebow style offense. I think LMJ would be a brilliant draft pick for the Broncos and they could probably get him in the 3rd or 4th round.
America's Obsession with Tim Tebow
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-gameday/09000d5d826a560d/America-s-Tebow-obsession?module=HP11_content_stream (http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-gameday/09000d5d826a560d/America-s-Tebow-obsession?module=HP11_content_stream)
I dont think they even mentioned him last night during the super bowl
Quote from: James V, The Calvary's Franchise on February 04, 2012, 02:11:33 PM
Since you're complaining so much about Tebow what's your team? I bet it's the Raiders or some team like that.
The Redskins. We suck and I know it. We need a lot of help on our team. The Broncos defense will keep the team in most games, but Tebow is a horrible passer and I just don't see him getting much better.
Quote from: Cory on February 05, 2012, 01:35:51 AM
Moreno is a bust, and they should cut him before they have to start paying him big money/resign. The resurgance of McGahee and a pick up in the offseason maybe a speed back is what they need
Yeah, I think he's going to be cut for sure especially after his DUI arrest.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d826b868d/article/broncos-moreno-reportedly-arrested-on-dui-charge-in-denver?module=HP11_MYNFL (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d826b868d/article/broncos-moreno-reportedly-arrested-on-dui-charge-in-denver?module=HP11_MYNFL)
Moreno should have stayed in college his senior season.
Tebow will be entering Season 3 next year. He's had two seasons as a mix of backup and starter. I think with his first full season on the horizon and given now he has had NFL experience, we can probably save our debate on him till then.
Looking forward to next year!
John Fox said he wants to bring in another 2 QB's to compete this off-season, so take it for what its worth.
So, you think he switches positions? Tebows still a very good open field runner....if he were to switch to Tight end wouldnt be surprised if he succeeds.
Nope, I think he's too stubborn to switch positions now.
Especially since he "led" a team to a playoff victory as a QB.
Have to think someone will take a flyer on him as a QB. It's actually a pity what Rex Ryan and the Jets organization did to his young career.
He has already said he doesn't want to switch positions. But if he wants to have a career in the NFL he is going to have to. The guy can't play QB in the NFL. We all know that and it's about time he realizes it as well. Switch to TE and get paid.
Quote from: JustinP on April 30, 2013, 07:27:58 PM
He has already said he doesn't want to switch positions. But if he wants to have a career in the NFL he is going to have to. The guy can't play QB in the NFL. We all know that and it's about time he realizes it as well. Switch to TE and get paid.
If he'd be willing to come in a play the wildcat in Philadelphia and line-up as wr/te as well (catching passes)... I'd love him as an offensive weapon under Chip's offense.
I think Belichick should sign him. Imagine all the plays that evil genius would come up with for him. Tebow should just be multipositional and realize that quarterback might not be his best option.
I do think Philly & New England are only 2 teams that make sense.
San Diego is the only other option since his former offensive coordinator from Denver is there.
Tim
Tebow
Sucks
top 3 college career of all time....honestly its him & Barry Sanders, then everyone else.
I speak only of pro ball, as it is all that I watch.
Quote from: GM Franchise on April 30, 2013, 10:27:20 PM
San Diego is the only other option since his former offensive coordinator from Denver is there.
San Diego is NOT an option if for ONLY that his coordinator is there.
He did get along good with him and they are on good terms so it's a possibility albeit a remote one. Plus maybe it'll motivate Rivers since he's a hothead, lol.
Honestly see only Philly and New England.
Phillys system is really the only one that he could fit into, and even then...
Pats because Bellichek loves Tebow and Florida Players. Bill would find a use for him
The CFL is his only option.
Yeah, even the Arena League doesn't want him.
Because, say it with me now.....
Tim.
Tebow.
Sucks!!!
Quote from: Mike Powers on May 19, 2013, 05:57:15 PM
Because, say it with me now.....
Tim.
Tebow.
Sucks!!!
Says it with him
Tim.
Tebow.
SUCKS!!
Ok does anyone think that any team is actually going to pick him up? All jokes aside. I think there is a possibility he will make a roster as a 3rd stringer. If I was weak at the QB position I'd be willing to gamble on him as the 3rd string guy. See what he has.
I think he finds a team before the season starts. Somebody has to take a gamble on him, right?
The Raiders love making bad decisions, surely they'll take a flier on him.
Tebow is surely the only guy who wishes Al Davis was still alive.
I say no team takes him before the season. The only way he makes a roster is as a backup if a team needs one due to injury. The circus that comeswith him is just not worth it.
I think his only hope was the Jaguars. Their GM has said he wasn't bringing him in so that leaves very few choices. I don't think he gets picked up until the pre-season, if he even does. My guess would be either the Bills or Dolphins.
Lol, if JaMarcus gets a job before Tebow
Tebow won't get a job because he's that poorly skilled its because of the mass media following him. Coaches don't like locker room distractions and Tebow is nothing but that.
If you're not prepared to start him. Don't hire him.
Quote from: Cory on May 29, 2013, 05:12:35 PM
Lol, if JaMarcus gets a job before Tebow
At least JaMarcus COULD be a good quarterback.
Quote from: JustinP on May 30, 2013, 06:01:12 PM
At least JaMarcus COULD be a good quarterback.
JaMarcus wasn't even a good College QB, lol.
Quote from: JustinP on May 30, 2013, 06:01:12 PM
At least JaMarcus COULD be a good quarterback.
Tebow is better than Jamarcus. At least Tebow can run. JaMarcus can only run to the nearest fast food joint.
Quote from: Jon on May 30, 2013, 07:51:53 PM
JaMarcus wasn't even a good College QB, lol.
But he has all the tools to be a good QB. Tebow doesn't.
I'd take Tebow over Fat JaMarcus anyday of the week.
One can't run and the other can't throw. Put them both together and maybe...MAYBE you get a half decent quarterback.
Quote from: Jon on May 30, 2013, 07:51:53 PM
JaMarcus wasn't even a good College QB, lol.
THIS.
Quote from: Cory on May 31, 2013, 12:39:08 AM
THIS.
He got picked #1. Must have done something right.
Quote from: JustinP on May 31, 2013, 11:35:38 AM
He got picked #1. Must have done something right.
I never have understood that.....I mean the RAIDERS did pick him and they always fuck up picks....but never understood why Russel was such a high pick...he was average QB stats (28-8) TD-INT ratio his final year.
I think it was a situation where he was the best prospect QB and Raiders needed one.
Quote from: Cory on May 31, 2013, 12:11:54 PM
I never have understood that.....I mean the RAIDERS did pick him and they always fuck up picks....but never understood why Russel was such a high pick...he was average QB stats (28-8) TD-INT ratio his final year.
I think it was a situation where he was the best prospect QB and Raiders needed one.
28-8 are good numbers. Plus LSU has never been a pass happy team. They like to run the football. He had the size and arm strength, but his weight and laziness got in the way....oh yeah and the codeine.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/31/report-tebows-camp-is-privately-admitting-hes-done-in-the-nfl/ (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/31/report-tebows-camp-is-privately-admitting-hes-done-in-the-nfl/)
Quote from: Doug E Fresh on May 31, 2013, 04:59:30 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/31/report-tebows-camp-is-privately-admitting-hes-done-in-the-nfl/ (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/31/report-tebows-camp-is-privately-admitting-hes-done-in-the-nfl/)
TIM
TEBOW
SUCKS!!
Quote from: JustinP on June 01, 2013, 02:40:29 PM
TIM
TEBOW
SUCKS!!
Welcome to the Dark Side of the Force.
Quote from: Mike Powers on June 01, 2013, 04:19:14 PM
Welcome to the Dark Side of the Force.
I've been on the darkside when it comes to that no talented hack. Now only if we can get James off the guys nuts and help him to the darkside.
Tebow will go be a motivational speaker for some Christian organization. Mark my words.
Meh, Tebow was a winner in NFL but never really a good QB at all.
However, if you try and discredit his college career (havent seen it here on EFK yet) your a utter idiot.
Tebow had a great college career, bottom line.
Quote from: JustinP on June 01, 2013, 05:08:16 PM
I've been on the darkside when it comes to that no talented hack. Now only if we can get James off the guys nuts and help him to the darkside.
I will when you stop saying the same thing over and over again on here.
I guess if anyone signs Tebow he needs to be on a team which can use him and there is NO DEBATE he is the starter. Orton and Sanchez provided debate because they were not elite Quaterbacks. I would personally like to see for him a move to say somewhere like New England where he has the option to be used as a utlity player maybe and I dont know...learn something. While Brady is there as well, there will never be a debate on whether Tebow is number 1 or not.
Or conversely, to a team where there is no deabate that he is the backup.
Yeah...should have looked at my wording or am I secretly...TEAM TEBOW!!
*nWo Music plays*
Quote from: Cory on June 01, 2013, 11:11:40 PM
Meh, Tebow was a winner in NFL but never really a good QB at all.
However, if you try and discredit his college career (havent seen it here on EFK yet) your a utter idiot.
Not discrediting his college career whatsoever.
This is what I don't get.
How can someone with SUCH a great College career flounder so horribly in the NFL?
It doesn't appear to be attitude or lack of commitment or enthusiasm. There has to be SOME NFL team that can use him in some way. Can he convert to a RB perhaps? Or be a backup? That's what I don't get.
College ball and the NFL are two vastly different beasts.
I understand that. The pace of the game is different, the way you play games is different. But they are still, at their core, football games. There's lots of people who can play in college who don't translate to the NFL, but how can Tebow not have ANY worth to a team? That's what I don't get. He can't make it on some just some shit team? The Browns? Bills?
I think he would do well on the Patriots or a team like that with a lot of unique play calls.
That's what I'm saying. He isn't a starting QB at all. His style doesn't work in the NFL as a regular QB, obviously. But he has to have SOME value. I would think either converting him to another position, or having him as a backup on a team where there's no question who the starter is, he'd have SOME value.
Quote from: Triple B on June 03, 2013, 03:28:35 PM
That's what I'm saying. He isn't a starting QB at all. His style doesn't work in the NFL as a regular QB, obviously. But he has to have SOME value. I would think either converting him to another position, or having him as a backup on a team where there's no question who the starter is, he'd have SOME value.
Tebow could easily make teams as a starting FB, or a backup TE....he just refuses to switch positions.
Quote from: Cory on June 03, 2013, 10:54:43 PM
Tebow could easily make teams as a starting FB, or a backup TE....he just refuses to switch positions.
He'd be a great H-back or TE. As Cory said, he refuses to switch positions. If he wants to keep playing he will swallow his pride.
Jesus doesn't allow you to swallow.
He'd be a terrible TE. LBs would have their way with him when he's blocking and his hands are a complete unknown.
H-Back maybe, but he'd end up on some terrible teams as an H-Back. He needs to go to the CFL or AFL and prove he can throw a ball. No one right now is giving him a shot to play QB
Looks like Tebow will be signed by New England.
He is signing with them. Source confirmed it.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000210586/article/tim-tebow-to-new-england-patriots (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000210586/article/tim-tebow-to-new-england-patriots)
EDIT:
This is the link I wanted. lol
http://tracking.si.com/2013/06/10/patriots-sign-tim-tebow/ (http://tracking.si.com/2013/06/10/patriots-sign-tim-tebow/)
And of course, because I can't resist... :P
Tim Tebow - "All He Does Is Win" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMK9FKMG3Nc#ws)
Quote from: Trumpers on June 02, 2013, 02:51:06 PM
I guess if anyone signs Tebow he needs to be on a team which can use him and there is NO DEBATE he is the starter. Orton and Sanchez provided debate because they were not elite Quaterbacks. I would personally like to see for him a move to say somewhere like New England where he has the option to be used as a utlity player maybe and I dont know...learn something. While Brady is there as well, there will never be a debate on whether Tebow is number 1 or not.
Despite my shit grammar...I am taking the call on that one!
Quote from: GM Franchise on April 30, 2013, 08:29:39 PM
I think Belichick should sign him. Imagine all the plays that evil genius would come up with for him. Tebow should just be multipositional and realize that quarterback might not be his best option.
Actually I called it a few months before that, Ian. :)
In all honesty, this is the best thing for Tebow.
If anyone can get him involved in an office, it's NE. And if anyone can teach him some stuff, it's Brady.
It really is the best place, Hoodie won't let him any where near a podium.
Green Bay would have been a good spot too. Really the only two spots he could have gone and not had a circus following him.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000210701/article/tim-tebow-bill-belichick-and-why-it-will-work?campaign=Facebook_atl_rosenthal (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000210701/article/tim-tebow-bill-belichick-and-why-it-will-work?campaign=Facebook_atl_rosenthal)
Quote from: JackHondo on November 13, 2007, 07:26:40 PM
Just watched a Florida game with this kid Tim Tebow playing. Mark my words, he's gonna make for some real controversy in the NFL in a few years.
Called it before all y'all.
;)
http://cdn2.tauntr.com/sites/default/files/Brady-Tebow-Frame.jpg (http://cdn2.tauntr.com/sites/default/files/Brady-Tebow-Frame.jpg)]http://cdn2.tauntr.com/sites/default/files/Brady-Tebow-Frame.jpg
Tebow and Patriots a match made in Heaven.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000210805/article/tim-tebow-bill-belichicks-patriots-a-match-made-in-heaven (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000210805/article/tim-tebow-bill-belichicks-patriots-a-match-made-in-heaven)
QuoteThe buzz sparked by the news that Tim Tebow would sign with the New England Patriots nearly broke the Internet on Monday afternoon. At least, it felt that way.
In March, I wrote an open letter to Tebow in which I begged him to sign with the Patriots. I'm an unabashed fan of both the "Patriot Way" and "Tebowmania," so I can't wait for this next chapter. This move makes a ton of sense for both the player and the team.
Let's run through some reasons to think things are going to work out well for Tebow in New England and consider some storylines to watch for, "Schein Nine" style.
1) The Patriots and Bill Belichick will control the noise
Patriots sign Tebow
Imagine the circus with no clowns. Imagine no animals, no flying trapeze, no music. Heck, there's no cotton candy. There's nothing. Welcome to New England Patriots football, where the players wonderfully talk in the code of "Beli-bots," churning out the most dreadful and least inflammatory clichés of all time while piling up wins and competing for a championship year after year.
If you like clowns, that's bad. If you like winning, that's a good thing. Tebow won't come with the clown show.
After the New York Jets traded for Tebow last year, they held a press conference introducing the backup quarterback -- and it took place in the field house, because the press room was too small. When Tebow was in Denver, fans put up a billboard urging the Broncos to play him.
In New England, Tebow won't get special treatment or attention. He has a special legion of fans, but in Boston, he'll fall way behind the Red Sox, the Bruins, the Celtics and the legendary coach and quarterback of the Patriots. He won't be available to the press any more than fellow backup quarterback Ryan Mallett. That's the way it should be.
Bad boys Corey Dillon and Randy Moss conformed in New England before. Tebow loves the attention, but he knows he was dangerously close to being out of the league. You won't see him running shirtless through the rain. ESPN won't be allowed to air special coverage, like when the network staked out Jets training camp. It will be the same, basic coverage. The Patriots will make it that way. Just consider how Belichick shut down persistent Tebow-related questioning from reporters on Tuesday.
As someone who has worked closely with Tebow over the past few years told me on Monday night, "I really don't think there will be a circus. Tim will fit into their model."
If you want a circus, take the kids to see Ringling Bros. Don't look to New England.
2) This is what Tebow needs
Sometimes, Tebow can't help himself. As a former Jet explained, "Tim's a good guy, but he always knows where the camera is."
His path -- first becoming a Broncos wunderkind, then being discarded in a trade to the Jets, then getting glued to the Jets' bench, then finally being released and floundering without a team, seemingly unwanted -- should've humbled him.
Tebow's been working this offseason on his mechanics, which are obviously flawed. He can learn from Belichick and Tom Brady. This sets up Tebow to restore his name.
3) In practice, Tebow time is for game time
Tebow is one of the worst practice players in NFL history, or at least it seems that way. As one former Jet told me Monday night, "He couldn't hit the broad side of a barn in practice." Tebow was awful enough in Denver to be the third-string quarterback behind the not-so-fabled duo of Kyle Orton and Brady Quinn. ... But when he saw game action, he was majestic enough to guide the Broncos to a playoff win over the Pittsburgh Steelers.
"Tim will never look good in practice, but Bill knows that heading into this," the source who has worked with Tebow pointed out to me.
The Jets failed by overreacting to Tebow's practice performance. Also, they were relying on him to be a key contributor. The Patriots aren't. In New England, he'll be a backup or a situational player.
4) Tebow will make the team and see the field
The Patriots aren't going to sign Tebow only to cut him.
I'll bet Belichick finds a way to get Tebow into games. As would be true of any other player, if Tebow can help the Patriots win in a certain week, he will play.
I'll also bet Tebow realizes that contributing in ways other than playing quarterback will be a boost -- and not a detriment -- to his NFL future. And I'll bet Brady will be OK handing the ball off to Tebow or letting Tebow run from the quarterback position one time per game, which will be akin to giving the pigskin to a running back.
I know we're seeing reports that Tebow will just be a quarterback. I don't buy it.
"I see him in a short-yardage, goal-line package, with some unbalanced line being used," one executive from a rival team told me. "The prep time alone will make things harder on Patriot opponents. Tebow will be far down their list of things to prepare for and he could be a significant weapon, because if you are not prepared, gaps can be unaccounted for."
That makes a ton of sense.
5) The Josh McDaniels factor
Tebow needs a "godfather," and he has one in Patriots offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels, who spent a first-round pick on Tebow when he was head coach of the Denver Broncos. McDaniels believes in Tebow and his uncanny knack for the moment. This can't be stressed enough.
McDaniels and Belichick crave smart, versatile, winning players. Say what you want about Tebow, but he most certainly can be described with those three adjectives.
6) The Urban Meyer factor
Belichick and Tebow's college coach, Urban Meyer, are very tight. Tebow will do anything to win football games. Nobody works harder. He's a bright player. Belichick appreciates that. If that attitude becomes contagious, that's a positive.
7) The Tom Brady factor
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Tebow fractured the quarterback room in Denver. He represented a distraction at every turn in New York. But there will be no such issues in New England.
Brady is a living legend, one of the best and most clutch quarterbacks in NFL history. He is larger than life. It's Brady's show.
This is a good thing for Tebow. For the first time in his NFL career, Tebow will be a pebble in someone else's shadow.
8) A "Slash" for a new day
Former Steelers quarterback Kordell Stewart was known as "Slash" for his ability to play all over the field. Well, Tebow is the new "Slash." He can be the ultimate decoy lined up in the backfield. He can run via the Wildcat or the reverse.
If I were Tebow, I would volunteer to play tight end, safety, special teams ... I would volunteer to get Brady his water. It's Tebow's job to tell Belichick he will do anything to help the team win -- while continuing to refine his game at quarterback.
9) Revenge, Tebow style
How ironic would it be if Tebow were to score more touchdowns than Mark Sanchez during the Jets-Patriots matchup on NFL Network in Week 2? I'll bet it happens. Ex-Jets always come back to burn Gang Green (see: Woodhead, Danny). Ever since hastily resigning as the "HC of the NYJ" years ago, Belichick has seemingly taken special pleasure in this phenomenon. Tebow will run the ball into the end zone in a lopsided Patriots win behind Brady -- and Sanchez will be on the bench.
Come on. You know that will be the script. It has to be, right?
Remember when the Jets thought they traded for a weapon? And they had a plan to give him 10 to 15 touches a game with Tony Sparano running the plays? Remember when the Jets guarded that plan so tightly last August -- only to never use it? Instead, they responded to Tebow's awful practice presence and watched Sanchez butt-fumble his way to an underachieving, turnover-marred season.
I still maintain that the Jets should've used Tebow. He was the best quarterback and runner on the roster, and nothing else was working. But they wasted him.
Don't you get the feeling that Belichick would love to remind them of that this fall?
Follow Adam Schein on Twitter @AdamSchein.
Quote from: TripleB on January 22, 1970, 10:50:08 AM
I was at the hospital today. I had a vision of a kid born on Aug 14, 1987. This kid that was born has this great name and he was throwing the bottle like he's been doing it all his life. Mark my words, that little guy Tim Tebow is going to be the center of the circus in the NFL after a legendary College career someday
Sorry Hondo, I beat you to it.
Aaron Hernandez was apparently in a bar fight in Gainesville in 2007. Who broke up the fight? Tim Tebow.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-football/22610653/tim-tebow-present-at-aaron-hernandez-gainesville-bar-fight-in-2007 (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-football/22610653/tim-tebow-present-at-aaron-hernandez-gainesville-bar-fight-in-2007)
QuoteLate Monday evening, the Wall Street Journal reported that Aaron Hernandez, currently held in prison on a murder charge, was part of a bar brawl as a 17-year-old in Gainesville where he ruptured a man's ear drum. But the WSJ left out the juiciest part of the story: Tim Tebow was there too.
[*Waits for everyone to finish gasping in shock*]
Yes, according to police records, via the Orlando Sentinel, Tebow was present at the bar when Hernandez was involved in a bar fight.
"Tebow stated that he witnessed the dispute," the officer wrote. "Tebow stated that he went over to try to help resolve the conflict."
Tebow apparently "urged Hernandez to leave peacefully" and tried to figure out how to get the bar bill paid.
And the current Patriots tight end was also present when the former Patriots tight end was interviewed with police a few hours later, assuring them that Urban Meyer was informed of the incident (I wonder if he'll want to talk about that?)
For whatever it's worth, Tebow would've been between 19 and 20 at the time of the incident -- he was born in August 1987, the incident occurred 20 years later. It's probably not worth much, though, since many bars allow patrons to enter if they're over 18.
That doesn't really help Hernandez though, since he was 17 at the time. Although it's certainly possible that the "bar" in question is a restaurant and doesn't require customers to be a certain age.
The real point is that Tebow was in a bar! as this Hernandez legal process unfolds, we are going to find out about every single time he even got within arm's length of John Law. It shouldn't reflect directly on him, nor should it give us the benefit of magical hindsight, nor should it affect the outcome of his trial.
It's just the grim reality of being famous, having a troubled past and facing murder charges in today's world.
Tags: Tim Tebow, Aaron Hernandez, Will Brinson, New England Patriots, NFL
Tebow on June 12th: Please God, almighty God, please allow me to remain on the Pats roster
Tebow on June 26th: Two weeks? You're slippin' G.
......bump?
Quote from: Cory on March 17, 2015, 10:01:45 PM
......bump?
Great, now Bradford broke his ankle.